Firearms

The .30 Carbine: The Original Personal Defense Weapon

Two brown toned .30 carbines on a dark gray cloth background

The .30-caliber U.S. M1 carbine was arguably the first of the modern class of lightweight personal defense weapons (PDW).Intended to arm soldiers who need lightweight arms, the PDW is a handy weapon that does not get in the way of other duties, such as driving a tank, manning a radio post or serving as an ammunition bearer. The idea was that the carbine gives soldiers an edge over a pistol. Troops normally armed with the 1911A1 .45 would be issued the M1 Carbine.

Two brown toned .30 carbines on a dark gray cloth background
Simple, reliable and lightweight the .30 carbine has a lot going for it.

Since the Philippine Insurrection, American soldiers had dealt with rear-area attackers. It is better to meet an unexpected attack with a short rifle than a pistol. The .30 carbine was designed to be more efficient than any handgun and not as heavy as the U.S. M1 Garand.

History of the M1

The M1 carbine succeeded famously. At just more than 5 pounds with a 36-inch overall length, the carbine is light and handy. The carbine was pressed into service on a greater scale than anyone had imagined in 1940 when it was conceived. The carbine vied with the submachine gun for the lead in short-range firepower, but it never replaced the pistol or submachine gun, although it was in greater use than either.

Wartime after-action reports and photographs from World War II clearly show that front-line troops on all fronts also used used carbines.

Multiple open boxes of .30 ammo on a dark gray background
The .30 carbine was the first American rifle that made carrying hundreds of rounds of ammunition practical.

After first envisioning the rifle in 1940, Winchester created the carbine after thorough and relatively fast development work. It made use of a tappet system developed primarily by David “Carbine” Williams. Winchester engineers also put a lot of work into the new carbine.

Like previous military carbines, the M1 featured an exposed barrel and short half stock. Unlike the earlier Trap Door Springfield and Krag carbines, the new U.S. M1 Carbine was not simply a short rifle chambered for a full-power cartridge. The new carbine featured its own unique cartridge.

The M1 carbine was also the first low-maintenance military firearm. Demands on the soldier to keep the piece running were relatively low when compared to other types. Since it was designed with a gas system not routinely field stripped in cleaning, the carbine had non-corrosive, primed ammunition. All .30 carbine ammunition had non-corrosive primers during a time when military ammunition was universally corrosive.

The .30 Carbine Through the Long Haul

When you look at the .30 carbine through the long haul, it was an important rifle and very influential. Best of all, the carbine proved reliable in action. Its 15-round magazine was a first for a soldier’s rifle and not only contained a good reserve of ammunition but also was exchanged quickly. Even the powerful and modern M1 Garand used a dated en bloc clip-loading system.

Two brown toned .30 carbines on a dark gray cloth background
A pair of carbines and a few magazines of ammunition make for a pleasant afternoon of shooting!

The only real problems with the M1 carbine were ballistics and terminal effect. In fairness, the carbine was intended for personal defense at moderate range. Dealing with sappers, preventing a machine gun position from being overrun, a tank being charged by grenadiers or an officer defending himself were the scenarios in mind when designers conceived the carbine.

The .30 cartridge was much less powerful than the full-power battle rifle cartridges. The bullet was not designed to break at the cannelure, and the cartridge did not produce sufficient velocity to ensure good effect past 100 yards. The .30 carbine was designed as an area defense or personal defense rifle and, in that category, it has performed admirably.

Interestingly, after-action reports from the Pacific are more glowing in terms of praise of the M1 carbine. The M1 survived World War II with its reputation largely intact.

When matched against heavily clad North Korean and Chinese adversaries in Korea, the carbine’s reputation suffered. Previously, in Europe, there had been some complaints, too many to discount. Within its design specifications, the carbine worked well; when pressed into action as a battle rifle, it was outclassed.

After-action reports from the Pacific in particular do speak highly of the carbine deployed within 200 yards. Perfect or not, the carbine saw use in every theater of operation in the hands of every unit, as well as in our allies’ hands, and was issued to German police after WWII.

The M1 Carbine was a success commercially with more than six million produced. We also made fully automatic carbines, known as the M2 and M3. We supplied the rifle in liberal numbers to many of our allies. It was still fighting in Africa and South America a decade or so ago. Photographic evidence shows the carbine was still a back-up rifle in Israel relatively recently.

After World War II

The Army did not procure the carbine after WWII because there were plenty of stores. Commercial ventures included the Universal, Plainfield and Iver Johnson carbines. While the commercial carbines vary in quality and many use cast rather than forged steel receivers, they often shoot well enough.

Two brown .30 stocks showing how you can change it to improve accuracy
A bit of careful stock work will improve the accuracy of the .30-caliber carbine.

For example, my Plainfield is tighter and more accurate than the Inland I often use. I prefer the Inland for hard use, even though it is more than 70 years old, simply because of its military heritage. Similar to the 1911 pistol, you may disassemble the M1 Carbine with only a cartridge case head.

The M1 Carbine often is fitted loosely. I read an old manual that said the carbine must keep its shots inside a 12-by-16-inch target at 100 yards. That is pretty loose, although better than a pistol. As a practical matter, the M1 Carbine usually groups 5 rounds into 6 inches or so at 100 yards, depending on how tight it is and how much work the shooter puts into tightening the barrel band and receiver-to-recoil plate fit.

My Personal Experience

My personal experience dates back to the 1970s when I briefly owned a Universal carbine. The rifle was not as accurate as my Winchester .30-30 and, while great fun, not powerful enough for hunting. Ammunition has always seemed overpriced for the carbine. I could not afford to keep anything that did not have a well-defined task, so I traded it.

As a peace officer, I often kept a Winchester .30-30 lever rifle in the trunk rather than the .30-caliber carbine. A few years later, a veteran deputy sheriff I respected showed me his personal emergency rifle, always kept loaded in the trunk of his cruiser. It was a GI .30-caliber carbine with a 30-round magazine loaded with Winchester 110-grain hollow points.

.30 carbine with a focus on the sights
The carbine sights are models of simplicity. They offer good accuracy potential well past 50 yards.

Numerous savvy shooters of the time kept carbines handy for emergencies. The rifle was so light, handy and reliable that it had a reputation as as a problem solver and excellent home defender. It took some time, and today, I appreciate the .30 carbine. I am enjoying an Inland carbine, the most common of the M1s, with more than two million made.

The original sighting equipment is still in place and deserves some discussion. The aperture rear sight is very fast on target and, coupled with the front post, gives a good sight picture for combat and precision shooting to 50 yards or so. By precision, I mean coyote and small game. You will find the sight well adjusted for 100 yards.

The second leg of the sight is for 300 yards, which is fine for area aiming and hoping to hit a man-sized target, although that is a stretch for sporting use. The .30-caliber carbine cartridge is interesting because it is, for all intents and purposes, as easily hand-loaded as a pistol round. There is some taper in the case, but it is not severe.

The cartridge is no bottleneck, and the cartridge case is 1.29-inches long. The standard loading is a 110-grain FMJ bullet at 1960 fps. Pressure is similar to Magnum revolver cartridges, 36,000 to 40,000 pounds per square inch. The .30-caliber carbine has the same energy as the .357 Magnum. Just the same, I have to report that the carbine did not produce the wounds that the .357 Magnum did at close range.

I have hand-loaded the carbine and will do more considering the high and rising cost of centerfire ammunition. The carbine is an economical plinker, particularly compared to the .308 Winchester and 7.62 x 39mm Russian, if you can find your spent cases.

A word to the wise: The open-mouth hollow points designed for the .32 Magnum may have the same nominal bore diameter, but they do not feed in the carbine, at least not in my Inland and Plainfield versions. The classic Speer Plinker 110-grain JSP is the trick in those rifles.

Hand-loading is simple and straightforward, using powder such as H 110, the same type commonly used to load .357 Magnum revolvers. I have heard about shooters using fast-burning propellants, such as Winchester 231, but I prefer to go with powder proven in long-term use and close to the original specifications.

I am well aware of the problems encountered with the M1 Garand when attempting to use relatively faster-burning rifle powder. While that is a completely different subject, I learned much from the Garand and will continue to use standard powder choices in self-loading rifles. The Garand will bend an operating rod if subjected to abuse. I do not know what the carbine will do, and I do not plan to find out.

 .30 carbine cartridge on the left and 12-gauge ammo on the right on a light gray background
The .30 carbine (left) compared to the .30-30 Winchester and the 12-gauge shotgun. It is useful but no powerhouse.

As for accuracy, the .30-caliber carbine is consistent. I have bench-rested several with Winchester 110-grain FMJ bullets and the new COR®BON  loading. While I would like to say my handloads lord over all the factory loads, that is not the case.

The factory loads consistently group into 4 to 5 inches for 5 shots at 100 yards. A reasonable goal for a good, tight .30 carbine is 4 inches at 100 yards. Most of my loadings have centered on reliable, low-cost recreational ammunition, and my personal handloads meet the 4-inch standard.

The .30 carbine is a self-loading cartridge, and you must produce consistent ammunition with a proper taper crimp for feed reliability and safety. The carbine is a docile rifle round, although it is a hot little number for its size. A bullet pressed into the case as a result of a poor crimp could cause pressure to skyrocket.

My Inland carbine was made in 1943, and the Plainfield in the 1960s. The Inland has seen hard use, evidently, so a comparison is far from fair, and the Plainfield does seem a bit more accurate on average, but the difference is slight.

The little guns have a great deal of history that I believe is overlooked. They served our GIs well not only in World War II but also Korea and Vietnam. Many state police officers as well as the New York City stake-out squads used them. Fighters in the South American banana wars also used them, and quite a few are still in use today.

The carbine is relatively inexpensive to obtain, maintain, shoot and enjoy. Just the same, it is a first-class choice for personal defense, close-range varmint shooting and just for fun.

The U.S. M1 carbine is one rifle I would not like to be without.

Inland Carbine Accuracy Results

Handload

Bullet Powder Velocity Group
Speer 110-Grain JSP 14.0 H 110 1,943 fps 4.5 inches

Factory Load

Load Velocity Group
Winchester 110-Grain FMJ 1,960 fps 4.5 inches
Winchester 110-Grain JSP 1,976 fps 2.95 inches
Speer 110-Grain Gold Dot 1,903 fps 4.0 inches
COR®BON DPX 2,011 fps 3.8 inches

Did you know how much history surrounds the M1? Do you have one? Share your thoughts and experiences in the comments section.

[bob]

The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt!'s blog, The Shooter's Log, is to provide information—not opinions—to our customers and the shooting community. We want you, our readers, to be able to make informed decisions. The information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper Than Dirt!

Comments (133)

  1. Personally I’ve never shot a M1 but do have a “don’t know what you have til it’s gone”. I went one weekend with my grandma to some yard sales, the people were friends from church and old friends from the town. The man had went the Monday after Pearl to in list, he lost his leg in the Philippines. You could look at the stuff set up and tell that his wife was responsible, nothing really major but still important to him.i came across a canteen cup that was packed with a couple of plain brown boxes and loss .30 Cal rounds with a inch of dust on top. I was only 10 or 11 and asked how much the lady said 3 bucks so I bought it, so happy to have a piece of ww2. Before we left her husband came out on his crutches to talk to my grandmother and seen what I had and asked “so your Jr’s grandson, you wanna see what those go to”? I obviously did. He took me to the basement garage /old man cave and reached in a dusty, dirty musty smelling corner and pulled out a old M1, it had surface rust and covered in cob webs. After a few minutes of handling the rifle he said that it didn’t work and needed something, extractor I think can’t remember, he never said this is my rifle from the war or how he was able to bring it home. After a few years past I’d see him when visiting my grandmother after my grandfather passed, and he was at the funeral in the ceremony. When I was 17 I stopped to talk to him one day and I asked about that rifle he said you know it’s in the same place it always been in go get it ,after a short visit and look at the rifle (worse shape than I remember) I said I got to go and went to carry the rifle back to its corner to waste away. After I put it back and was headed out to the car he said “what did you do with the rifle?” I said I put it back,”well go get it take it home with you” by God I did and was tickled to death. I didn’t know a lot about guns I know it was a Winchester, I did clean it up and slather it in oil but never tried to have it fixed. I had only one gun before and was never allowed to keep it in my room or hardly shoot it. That was a .22 short bolt action. After I started dating I never thought about those guns and when about 19 I let my uncle (that was always getting over on somebody) talk me into letting him take and try and fix the gun I agreed. It wasn’t until 2 or 3 years later that I asked about it and he said well I finally figured out what it needed and couldn’t afford the parts so I sold it. I was furious I said that was my gun you wanted to try and fix it, he said no you told me me I could have it and when I went and got it your mother(his sister) handed him the 22, he said no the other one so she went into what was my room and got it. Like a bandit he started talking about something else and left with both guns. She did ask if he was supposed to come by and get a gun I told her yes, her more than happy to get them out of the house didn’t care.
    Today I have a couple of guns including a early Colt M16 A2 with a newer single fire lower,1911.45, and a few other odds and ends. But still after 25 years still think about what I had.

    1. Absolutely, buddy I can’t count the things I let slip away that I either didn’t know what the heck it was, traded or let a family member CON me out of it

  2. The most iconic photo of an M1 carbine was not a wartime photo – but one taken of Malcolm X holding one with two tactically wrapped magazines looking out a window at the street below: This was following several death threats he received after calling out Elijah Mohammed, the leader of the Nation of Islam, for having affairs with NOI secretaries and then leaving the NOI to start his own mosque:

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-rw0s_B7B6H4/UwX-8WBKoVI/AAAAAAAAHWw/toOg4GXCJhU/s1600/1964+with+gun.jpg

  3. Have a Quality hardware import by, I think, blueskies.. Has a Choate folding stock. Shots great, can bust clay pigeons at 35 yds every shot. It’s always in my vehicle.t

  4. I carried a mi carbine on watch, Loved it accurate dependable and light. I wish I had one now. I do have a Ruger Black Hawk .30 carbine revolver. I find that ammo is a bit pricey. Here is one for you to try, set up a dead flat screen computer monitor at 35 feet. hit it dead square in the middle. It will stop the .30 carbine round fired from the Black Hawk revolver.

  5. I have an Iver Johnson M1A1 that had a composite stock with a swing arm butt.
    It got broken by accident and it was replaced at No Charge because Iver Johnson gave a Life-time warranty on the Stock.
    I was pleasantly surprised that after me buying this M1 over 40 years ago that it was still under warranty.
    God Bless America !

  6. I was fortunate enough to acquire an “armorers special” from the Korean war. For those who don’t know what that is, put together from a lot of different weapons. I had mine checked out by a Navy “guy” that collected them and found out it was made of no less than 7 different manufacturers’ parts. One really nice part is the stock is from 1942 but the bolt is an M-2 model round-face and as a result will cycle faster than the standard M-1 carbine bolt…so I’ve been told. Can’t say that for a fact myself. It has a really nice original sling and it does shoot very well. Grouping is 3-3.5″ at 100yds. Even though it has seen action in two wars that I know of, it is in remarkable condition. Terrific varmit rifle…Take your pick of varmits.

  7. I just inherited my father-in-law’s M1 Carbine. During WW2, as a bomber pilot in the Pacific he couldn’t carry it in his B-24, so he only used it a couple of times to shoot Japanese infiltrators trying to blow up his aircraft in Saipan, Palau and Angaur. When he got called up for the Korean War he flew a DC-3 and would dynamite the airfields as we retreated from the NK initial invasion into the Pusan perimeter and later the Chincom invasion. As the last to fly out, he usually got attacked by infantry at the other end of the runway and his butt stock still has a Chinese hand grenade fragment. embedded.

    At age 96, he could still do a nice grouping with that M-1 carbine at 100 yards, standing up. I wound up getting the carbine because he wanted to be buried with it but Arlington wouldn’t allow for an O-6 with two DFC’s and a Silver Star to be buried with his personal ordnance so he gave it to me.

    1. @ DarthVaderMentor.

      That’s “Absurd”, My father was a WW2 Veteran that held a “Brevet Lieutenant Colonel” rank. But was Buried as a “Major”, Given FULL Military Honors at Arlington back in 1997…

    2. @Secundius

      I think you misunderstood – he didn’t say they wouldn’t bury his father, just that his father couldn’t be buried with his personal ordnance. Therefore your father’s interment had no bearing on DARTHVADER MENTOR’s comment.

  8. There’s a Company called Sandy Gun Works, which offers an FNH 5.7×28 “Spitfire” Iver Johnson M1 Carbine. Good for ~250 to ~300-meters, talk is that a 7.92×33 Kurz is in the works with an probable ~600-meter range.

  9. My Grandpa had a WWII era Para that was the second gun I ever fired. I wanted one for many years and finally came across Rock-Ola about 3 years ago. I love my AR, AK and other rifles, but this one ranks up there with my JC Higgins (Sears and Roebuck catalog) model 30 22LR (also from my Grandpa) as my SHTF rifle of choice. The heavy trigger-pull means you have to have intent to fire it, it never jams or suffers from FTF malfunctions, and it always hits what I aim at (medium to close range). Longer ranges are doable, as well, but with a little less accuracy. 200 meters is the far end of accuracy for my little carbine, but that’s what the scoped rifles are for. I love my .30 Carbine.

    1. Most M1 and M2 Carbines wear either 5 to 8-pound Trigger’s depending who manufactured them. The Lightest you going to find anywhere is 2-1/2-pounds. I can’t give any specifics, because there’s so many of them out there. But any Reputable Gun Smithy, should be able to do it at a Nominal Fee.

  10. If someone made one in 10mm Auto I would buy it in a heartbeat. Out of a 16″ barrel a 10mm would be awesome..

    1. @ tiretroll

      There are NO ACTUAL M1 Carbine in 10-mil. manufacturers, but are several Conversion Gunsmith Companies to choose from.

  11. this is for ( jack Russell ). I own 2 m1 carbines. a universal and auto ord. I’ve used many rounds of fmj for target and plinking. good out to 100 yrds and the best that I used was armscor, aguila and hertrs. all work well. I use my sp for hunting deer here in maine. good luck

  12. I load 110 FMJ, brass casings with 14.3 gr of H110 for about 2000 fps. Picked up two ww2 30 carbines in the 80s for 150 ea. when I was looking for a good SHTF, CQB rifle. These rifles are light, accurate,and fast handling. The average shooter should able to hit anything out to 100 yds with ease. I’ve tested this FMJ load and have seen it plow through car doors, sheet rock, brush, small trees,sheet metal, wood and aluminum doors and still smack the targets behind them with force. I prefer fmj penetration for urban cqb applications when it may be necessary to take out targets firing from behind light cover.

  13. During my tour of 16mos. on the Korean DMZ 1956-57, as Hq. Btry. Radio Chief my assigned weapon was an M-2 Carbine with seven 30rnd Banna clips… what a jewel, the Bn only had seven M-1 Garands all the issue weapons were M-1 30 cal Carbines and 45cal “Grease Guns”. Upon discharge the 1st gut I bought for my collection was a used Iver Jphnson M-1 30 Cal Carbine with two 15 rnd , two 30 rnd and one 40 rnd clip. Still have it and it has never had any problems. I only wish i could find some ammo more devestating than SP’s…Is there anything else out there?

    1. Don’t know if you reload. I own a Universal M1 carbine I reload for and I also have a couple of 7.62×25 Tokarevs that I reload for. The 85-90 grain Tokarev bullets are hard to find so I followed most online advice and used the 100-110 grain M1 30 carbine bullets to reload. They work fine! Now to get to your point, I have noticed on eBay tool sets to manually hollowpoint (utilizing a drill bit) Tokarev bullets as HP Tokarev bullets are impossible to find. I don’t have one and think they utilize a loaded cartridge to function, but maybe there is a 30 cal carbine analog out there?

    2. @ Roger.

      Never used or reloaded the M1 or M2 Carbines. Talk to Martin Pierce, hes the resident expert in these parts of The Shooter’s Log world. He’ll walk you through it step-b-step.

  14. I’ve shot literally thousands of rounds of steel case ammo through a variety of weapons and have never encountered any problems that I have not also encountered with brass cased ammo. I would use it for defensive purposes unless it was all I had, but it is great for target shooting and plinking.

    1. @ Texsputin.

      Glad I could you and ss1 out. Also keep in mind that the steel used in US manufactured is stainless, which is spark resistant, the steel used in Russian manufactured is not stainless or spark resistant.

  15. @ ss1 & Texsputin.

    You two shouldn’t have any problem, if you use standard precautions. In general Brass Casings are generally safer too handle and use. US. manufactured Steel Cased ammunition are specially treated with a Clear-Coat, too prevent static electricity. Russian made ammunition, I don’t know much about the manufacturing process to safely tell you its OK. You have to rely on your judgement.

  16. I have used Wolf brand 110 grain full metal jackets in my Universal weapons with no problas well as my Auto-Ordnance Para. I don’t know about World War 2 era weapons

    1. @ ss1.

      Since the 17th century, Naval ships lined the Shot Lockers or Magazines in brass. Because of “static electricity”. Well the same holds true for brass cased ammunition. Steel cases ammunition, while easier to produce. Still, have an “static electricity” problem. It doesn’t take much “static electricity” to set of a powder charge. Rubbing your hand together to keep warm will do it. Clothing rubbing together will do it. Even having a loaded flashlight with batteries will do it. When I use steel cased ammunition for my AK-74 Bullpup rifle, I will liner my dopp bag or range bag, with brass or bronze foil. Or, just us a Static Electricity Grounding Devise or Faraday Box/Cage.

    2. Secundius and Texsputin,

      Thanks for your replies about steel cased ammo. I will look into the Universal, but so far I don’t like the 18 inch barrel on the Auto-Ordance Para, because that’s not a carbine, and that barrel length is not necessary for short range.

      As far and the warning about steel cased ammo and static electricity, I must have loaded over 1500 cartridges into AK mags, and I sure hope I’m not risking my hand doing it.

  17. I knew that they had reached a point where they had to intermingle parts as they ran out of the, guess you could call it surplus, but never knew that it could affect it to the point of not taking, or rather, feeding from a GI mag. I guess it doesn’t matter if they are after market mags? So Universal still makes the mags as they will get more in? Do you know what year your weapon was built, or perhaps the serial #? I would like to follow this up for my own curiosity. Thanks for filling me in – would really love to hear how it works out. Good luck!

  18. Thanks for your response. I did some research and discovered that for a while, Universal used existing GI components. When those ran out, they started making their own. Over time, many GI parts would not interchange with Universal M-1 Carbines. I have one of those later models. I have located a gunsmith who believes he can modify my chamber ramp to work more like the M-4 dual ramp, which itself is different from the M-16 I carried in Vietnam. Universal in Hialeah, FL made the inline magazines I am forced to use now. I have seen them in 15 round configuration, but they were out of stock. The feed on all those mags, and mine, is dead center, inline with the single ramp to chamber.

    1. OK, OK! I give! I have tried to figure out that acronym every since you posted it. I even Googled AND Bing!’ed it! What does OFWU stand for (at least put me on the right track or give me a hint)!

  19. I do indeed own Universal mags for my M-1 carbine. They only hold 4 rounds, made of nylon, and made by Universal. They are single stack, and feed from the very center, and reliably I might add. GI mags will absolutely not work with my Universal. They jam into the sides of the chamber, alternating left and right. I have tried 6 different GI mags, and they all have the same problem. That’s why I asked if a gunsmith could groove the receiver like and M-4.

    1. Well, with over 6 million M1’s made, w/ say minimum 4 mags each, that’s 24 million mags, maybe conclusively saying that NONE will work after trying only 6 might be a bit premature, but I certainly understand your frustration. Have you found anything online about the 4 shot mags or their background? Have you ever taken it to, say, a pawnshop or a gunshow, see if anyone might be able to shed any light on it? I can say that in almost 50 years of owning and shooting M1’s (I currently have 6) I have encountered only one, really, type or style of magazine, although it comes in 10, 15, and 30 round (normally – also have seen 5 rd and 42 rd) capacities). Every M1 I have fired has used the same type mag, and although I have certainly encountered mags that made me want to take heavy machinery to them, I have yet to see an M1 that had to be modified to take the standard issue mag. I will add that of the scores of M1’s I have handled at guns -shows/ -shops and private collections they all appeared to take the same mag, but hot having actually fired it I cannot attest to it. That does not mean that they don’t exist, just that I have not encountered them. I did a quick search online and didn’t find any info except some 4/5 round plastic mags shown in ad’s for ’68/’69 Universal Hunting Carbine on Ebay. They called it .30 cal carbine, had a Dupont finish (the Cat’s Meow of the time) and could be converted to bolt action (?). But that was all I came up with. Check around and see if there isn’t some type of re-enactment group or hunting club in the area that perhaps could direct you to a reliable gunsmith who can possibly solve this mystery. Good luck and keep us posted!

  20. There’s no such thing as an obsolete weapon, if it can draw blood or kill you it isn’t obsolete, Archaic by modern standards, but certainly not obsolete.

  21. I HAVE A UNIVERSAL CARBINE AND I POSTED MY THOUGHTS BEFORE.
    THANK YOU FOR SHEDDING LIGHT ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE RECEIVER BEING FOR THE SELECTIVE FIRE PART. I ALWAYS BELIEVED IT WAS A SPACE FOR A SCOPE MOUNT.
    AGAIN THANK YOU.

    1. mine came from my uncle who was killed on IWO he was really Marine
      cpl James Ryan the one with three other brothers . He made 25 days
      on the island before he was killed his best friend sent his mother his rifle
      dress uniform two swords and a old 45 . Boy does that little gun talk !!!!
      Lou

  22. AS A SOLDIER IN THE KOREAN WAR I CARRIED AN M-2 CARBINE CAPABLE OF BEING USED AS A “ONE-SHOT-AT-A-TIME” AND ALSO –BY FLIPPING A LITTLE “SWITCH”–MAKING IT INTO A SMALL HELD SUB-MACHINE GUN CAPABLE OF FIRING 600 ROUNDS PER MINUTE.

    IT WAS A WONDERFULL WEAPON AND I WISH I HAD ONE NOW !!!!

    SO, WHERE CAN I GET AN M-I, AT THIS TIME ???

    1. Thank you for your service to our country! It is particularly refreshing to hear positive comments about the M1 from a vet of the Korean conflict as that’s where much of it’s bad reputation originates. M1 carbines are not hard to find. Auto Ordnance makes them still, or were the last time I checked. You should be able to find a Universal (used, of course) at any gun show or online at one of the gun trading/selling sites. Paired with the right ammo it makes a great home defense weapon and can hold it own out to 100 yards, further if the shooter does his part. The main drawback I find is that ammo is expensive, even for plinking, and ammo for defense is REALLY defensive. Good luck!

  23. @ Ken.

    David Marshall Williams (aka. Carbine Williams), November 13, 1900 to January 8, 1975. Invented the M1 Carbine, In or around the early 1940’s. He was a Moonshiner and convicted murder. He killed Deputy Alfred Jackson Plate of Cumberland County, North Carolina in July 22, 1921. And was sentenced to life at hard larbor. As far as the .30-caliber (7.62x33mm) round is concerned, it was manufactured by Winchester Repeating Arms Company. In either late 1939 or early 1940. No firm manufacturing date can be found, most likely lost, stolen or destroyed records. I don’t know if any of this helps you out any.

  24. I bought a Universal M-1 in 1967 and had it until this past year when I sold it to buy an AR-15. Mine had the metal guard and the serial number was 0075. One really neat thing happened to me about a year after I got the rifle. My cousin was the head gunsmith for the WV National Guard and he had his own shop at his home. I had the gun there one night showing it to him and commented on the fact that there seemed to be a gap on one side of the stock that wasn’t on the other side. I made a remark about workmanship but he just smiled and said he would show me why the gap was there. He went to his bench and took the rifle apart. He then got a couple of parts from his bins, put them on the carbine, and put the rifle back together. He put five rounds in a mag and told me to go out side and fire into the hillside by his shop. I soon found out that the gap was to make room for the selector switch and my M-1 was now an M-2. I fired the five rounds fully automatic!! He then took those parts off the rifle and gave me back my M-1. What a thrill.

  25. I have a Universal M-1 Carbine. I can’t find magazines for it. It takes a center feed mag, as opposed to GI M-1s which feed like an M-4, due to the staggered mag. Is it possible to have a gunsmith double groove the feed ramp to accept rounds like an M-4?

    1. I currently own three universal M1s, a Universal Enforcer, one 1944 Inland and one Auto-Ordnance paratrooper copy, and all the mags I have are, and always have been, interchangeable. I have been buying and shooting M1s since I got my first one in 1972 and have never seen one that took a magazine that was not the same staggered style, be they 10, 15 or 30 round. What is it that makes you infer that it requires a ‘center feed’ mag? I’m guessing you have such a mag – can you determine who made it?

  26. I have my dad’s M1 paratrooper he carried in his medevac chopper in Viet Nam. It is great, but the metal folding stock is missing. Does any one know where I can get the metal stock?

  27. Yes.. I do own an M1 Carbine and it has 1000s of rounds out of it and its a really great gun out to 100 yds. I also have a .30 carbine Ruger Blackhawk that makes a great companion for the lit M1.

    1. When I was 14 my dad got me an Inland M1 carbine made by General Motors in 1944. I have fired many many thousands or rounds out of the weapon. I also later purchased the Blackhawk pistol. But with the pistol I had to use ear protection. I am almost 70 now and the weapon is still in perfect condition.

  28. @ larry.

    There.s this Cable Show called Trigger’s on the Military Channel. A couple years ago, they squared-off the M1 Garand Battle Rifle against the AK-47 Assault Rifle. And believe it or not, but M1 Garand Battle Rifle outperformed the AK-47 Assault Rifle in every category, with the exception of one. And the category where the AK outperformed the M1 was Magazine Storage Capacity 30+1-rounds against 8+1-rounds.

  29. One question that I have never found an answer to about the M-1 Carbine round is how much was it influenced by the aborted attempt to make the M1903 a semi-automatic? looking at the M-I rounds and the port cut into my M1903 Mark I they look awfully close, and it was a ‘pistol’ style cartridge that the Pederson Device was made for. Just a curiosity of mine since my wife and I are trying to collect any WW II firearms that we can get and afford.

    1. @ Ken.

      Try the Sportsman’s Guide outfitters, you can get Cartridge Converters. That will allow you to use M1 Carbine .30-caliber (7.62x33mm) rounds in a 30.06-caliber (7.62x63mm) M1903, M1 Garand, or any other similar Rifle livery system.

    2. @ Ken.

      Sorry about The Sportsman’s Guide, I thought for sure they would have the 7.62x33mm to 7.62x63mm Chamber Inserts you were looking for. I just finished talking to a friend of mine, who was also looking for the same sized Chamber Inserts. And he found them at a place called Boolits Gunloads. Their web address is http://boolits.gunloads.com

      I hope this company can help you out.

    3. @Secundius,
      Thanks for the info on that, but I am not looking for a converter. If I do get anything it will be a repro of the Pederson Device. I understand that there is someone out the remaking them. I was just wondering if anyone knew the history of the .30 Carbine round enough to say if it was influenced by that invention. It allowed the M1903 to fire semi-auto in a landscape of bolt action rifles. The higher ups did not like it due to the fact it did not fire a rifle round, and did not pack the punch they wanted. The cartridge lengths appear to be so similar It started me to wondering about the history of the .30 Carbine round. Is it a recycled idea from the Pederson Device or did they jus reinvent the wheel for that cartridge. So far I have not been able to find any information on the actual development of the two cartridges.

  30. I recently purchased a Kahr M1 Carbine from a friend. He had purchased it a few years ago; fired one 15 round magazine through it and then put it in storage. When I obtained the little rifle; I liked it a lot. I did find that finding good ammo was a little difficult and relatively expensive. When it came time to shoot; I was extremely disappointed. The weapon was very sensitive to magazine type and no matter what magazine I used; it would ALWAYS try to load two rounds at once and jam. Also, spent rounds would not eject which caused the bolt to jam causing all sorts of problems. The gun has been returned to Kahr for review and hopefully repair. I am hoping that Kahr just replaces the entire weapon with a new one. Luckily, the friend that I purchased this from is a true ‘Southern Gentleman” and he took the weapon back and refunded my money and he is dealing with Kahr (Thanks Joe…). When this rifle or the replacement comes back; I will re-purchase it from Joe IF I can shoot 200 rounds of various ammo using various magazines without any issues. Hoping for the best… Thank you.

  31. Also interesting to note on the M1 car., back in the `30`s when it was being developed, Winchester had their chambering in .351 Self Loading Rifle, more power than the .30 version. I owned a US Postal Meter version of the M1, and did my own ballistics comparison, with the .351, it won the shooting match on all counts.
    Also , the M1 was issued to ROK troops in the `50`s, and to ARVN troops in the `60`s.

    1. @ FUSAG 1.

      You also have to factor in The Great Depression. People were starving, some people 1 in 4 people were homeless and didn’t have jobs. while other say it might have as high a 2 in 5 people. and with country with a population of around 115 to 120-million people, that a lot people that unemployed. And most people weren’t by guns at the time. They were just trying to stay alive and being employed. I don’t know how much a Carbine or Rifle in .351-caliber cost at the time, Even it it cost $100 USD at the time, that was more money then most people made in a year, it most likely fell out of favor with most people, and faded into obscurity at the time.

  32. My father has one of these great little weapons. He worked at Anniston Army Depot. In the late 60’s U could purchase a weapon through the NRA from the depot. His friend & next door neighbor work, and was over small arms dept. So dad bought one of the M1’s, but it had to be used, not new. So his friend built him a brand new one, but give him an old sling for the M1. So now U couldn’t call it a brand new weapon. But that afternoon when they got home, his neighbor called him and told him to come over. When he got there, the neighbor reached in his pocket and handed him a brand new sling to go with his brand new M1. And to make it much better, the parts to make it a M2. And to this day the weapon still looks new. I bet there hasn’t been over 50 rounds put through it. And one day, that M1 will sit by my Mini-14 & AR-15.

    1. That is indeed a special weapon – not only is it in top mechanical shape, it has a pedigree within your family! What are the legal ramifications of having a weapon as well as having the parts to make it full auto – is it considered legal as long as it is not assembled?

  33. I entered service in June 1967. In BMTS we fired the M-16, which, as a teen, I had watched being tested for adoption by the newly formed USAF Air Commandos, for which my father was an instructor. My first duty station was Travis AFB, then a SAC base with a MAC subordinate unit. I was assigned to the MAC contingent of the Air Police, which shortly became the Security Police. We were armed with Smith and Wesson M&P K-15 .38 revolvers (which we loaded with only 5 rounds). Our shoulder arms were M-16s. We also had M-12 shotguns. Eight hours of walking the aircraft ramps or around an alert bomber or refueling aircraft with a radio the size of a laptop, a revolver, M-16, extra ammo, in the cold, rain, heat of summer.

    In 1968, due to a buildup in Vietnam, all of our M-16s were taken from us and shipped off to be reconditioned. In place of the M-16s, we were issued M-2 carbines. They were much easier to carry than the M-16s when out “humping” the ramp or an aircraft. As I recall, we never got our M-16s back before I shipped out to Vietnam in January 1969, where it was back to the M-16 for me.

    I loved that little M-2, and many years later (2012) I purchased a Saginaw M-1 carbine. It may not shoot as fast, but it’s still sweet, and I had little problem qualifying expert with it.

    Today, my M-1 carbine shares safe space with my Mini-14 and AR-15 carbine.

    1. Back in 1975 I bought a MI-Carbine Universal and Made in Florida, from My Brother for $15.00. . I have several other Self defence Guns But for it being Light and easy to shoot,I think it is my favorite weapon. I wish I knew its age?.

  34. @ Larry.

    My father told me once, back in the ’70’s. That fighting in WW2, was like fight with a Tool Box. And used the Tools that were available at any given time. He told me about a buddy of his that carried two rifles, one was the M1 Garand and the other was the Mauser 98K. Because when you run out of your own ammunition you can always use your dead enemies ammunition.

  35. He received his MOH using a MaDuce mounted on a disabled troop carrier against two/three Germany tanks and Germany troops. He was blown off the troop carrier once but remounted and continued to fire. He said a Germany squad tried to flank he but he saw them advancing up a small ditch and “Stacked Them Like Cord Wood”. His exact words.

  36. Sorry about the double post. Tied to edit some typos before it was posted. That doesn’t work. In any case read the second one. It’s a little cleaner.

    1. @ Lenwood.

      Sometimes I think I should in a Think Geek Dictionary For Dummies. Just too read some of these postings. I know that Modern English replace Old English, but this New English seem like it was created on another Planet from Alternate Universe.

  37. When I went through basic training in the early 1960s we were required to qualify on both the M1 Garand and the M1 Carbine.

    I shot sharpshooter with the Garand but I couldn’t touch the target at 100 yards with the carbine. I was the training platoon sergeant and my cadre sergeant worked extra with me, letting me fire three more 10-round magazines with the same sorry result.

    Finally, he gave up in frustration and told me to follow him down to the target trench where we pulled my target down and actually found two hits outside the bull out of 40 shots. And the bulls eyes were huge!

    He took his lead pencil and punched holes in the target carefully rubbing lead around the edge of the holes, all the while muttering something about “these damn range guns.”

    And, I qualified or should I say I WAS qualified. Still, I was puzzled as to why I could shoot so well with almost any long gun except the carbine..

    But after that, I never fired a carbine again though I carried one continuously for the rest of the time I was in the service without a lot of confidence that it would help me if I ever needed it.

    Then.30+ years later when I inherited a carbine from my dad after he passed away. I didn’t even know he had it. My uncle, a captain with the 82nd Airborne Division, had brought several back from WWII and had traded it to my dad for a 1911 .45 which dad had brought back.

    My dad had it restocked with a sportster stock and planned to use it for deer hunting. I don’t think he ever fired it because he had an unopened wooden military case of 1000 rounds in 10-round magazines in cloth packs.

    With some trepidation, I broke open the case, and took three clips to the range fully expecting to have the same difficulty that I had experienced in the service.

    When I fired the first magazine at 100 yards I was astonished to find that all ten rounds were inside the 12-inch bull. I then had great fun in firing the other two magazines with about the same result.

    So, I learned after 30+ years that the problem I had on that army range so long go was with the gun and not ME!

    Since then, I only fire new ammo or my own reloads, saving the remainder of the original ammo as historical relics.

    While I wish Dad had not replaced the stock, I still relish that little gun which is an ideal deer rifle in the thick pin oak woods of northeast Arkansas where dad would have used it. It’s a sweet little gun and so much fun to shoot.

  38. I purchases my two M1 carbines from gun shows in the 1980’s — when they could still be acquired for $250-300 in excellent condition. I have the proverbial Inland and the General Motors versions, and both are excellent shooters. I will miss the days when our military surplus was an affordable way to shoot as well as collect. I also will miss the days when our government didn’t arm our enemies (at taxpayer cost) better then it allowed it’s own citizens to buy their own firearms. Read over “250,000 U.S. bought AK47’s disappear in Iraq and Afghanistan,” and then read “Obama Administration Reverses Course, Forbids Sale of 850,000 Antique Rifles (M1 Garand’s).” I’m sick of this administration and every time I see our president speak I want to throw up just looking at him. Thanks God we still have legislative branches of government. Let’s hope and pray for a good candidate 2 years from now. Maybe we can save our 2nd amendment rights (and a few surplus rifles) for our children.
    Former U.S. Marine competitive pistol team member and proud N.R.A. member, living in what used to be the south.

  39. When I went through basic training in the early 1960s we were required to qualify on both the M1 Garand and the M1 Carbine.

    I shot sharpshooter with the Garand but I couldn’t touch the target at 100 yards with the carbine. I was the training platoon sergeant and my care sergeant worked extra with me, letting me fire three more 10-round magazines with the same result. Finally, he gave up in frustration and told me to follow him down to the target trench where we pulled my target down and actually found two hits outside the bull out of 40 shots.

    He took his lead pencil and punched holes in the target carefully rubbing lead around the edge of the holes, all the while muttering something about “these damn range guns.”

    And, I qualified or should I say I WAS qualified. Still, I was puzzled as to why I could shoot so well with almost any long gun except the carbine..

    But after that, I never fired a carbine again though I carried one continuously for the rest of the time I was in the service without a lot of confidence that it would help me if I ever needed it.

    Then.30+ years later when I inherited a carbine from my dad after he passed away. I didn’t even know he had it. My uncle, a captain with the 82nd Airborne Division, had brought several back from WWII and had traded it to my dad for a 1911 45 which Dad had brought back.

    My dad had it restocked with a sportster stock and planned to use it for deer hunting. I don’t think he ever firedit because he had an unopened wooden military case of 1000 rounds in 10-round magazines in cloth packs.

    With some trepidation, I broke open the case, and took three clips to the range fully expecting to have the difficulty that I had experienced in the service.

    When I fired the first magazine at 100 yards I was astonished to find that all ten rounds were inside the 12-inch bull. I then had great fun in firing the other two magazines with the same result.

    So, I learned after 30+ years that the problem I had on that army range was with the gun and not ME!

    Since then, I only fire new ammo or my own reloads, saving the remainder of the original ammo as historical relics.

    While I wish Dad had not replaced the stock, I still relish that little gun which is an ideal deer rifle in the thick pin oak woods of northeast Arkansas where dad would have used it. It’s a sweet little gun and so much fun to shoot.

  40. Great history lesson on the M1 Carbine, but you left out a picture and story of the Paratrooper version. Back in the 40s, my father was able to get one of the Paratrooper, collapsible stock version. We lived on a Vermont farm and with the stock collapsed, the gun fit right in next to the tool box on his Ford Dearborn tractor. He kept it there for the occasional Woodchuck or Rabbit he would see when mowing the fields for hay. My nephew now has it and it is a prized family weapon!!!

  41. Several years ago when it was cheap, I purchased almost 500 rounds of Russian 7.62 x 25 pistol ammo and pulled the 85 grain FMJ bullets for my .30 Carbine. The 7.62 pistol bullets that I bought are not the .310-.312″ in diameter as are those found in the AK-47 ammo……. they all measured between .306 and .308″ in diameter and work perfect in my little carbine!

    Initially, I had sight problems too but with the loads that I now use, whether the 85 grain take outs or the the run of the mill 110 grain FMJ and round nose soft points, busting 4″ in diameter rocks and picking off soda/beer cans sure is no problem!

    If the wife is alone for some reason or another, the little carbine gets a 30 round mag put in it and if she has a problem, somebody else is going to have a lot bigger problem!

    The little gun would really have been a killing machine if at the time they have chambered it to a 110 grain spire point FMJ, but love the little gun anyway!

    One bit of caution thought…….. don’t stand right behind it when it is being fired! Only one worse for throwing brass is the Ruger .44 Mag carbine……… and the cases coming out of either are hot enought to “weld” to exposed skin oun you forearm if you are a by-stander!

    My son learned this lesson two years ago!

    Have fun with the neatest little gun ever!

    A.C. in south central Idaho

  42. This was the favorite gun of Audie Murphy, the CMO recipient and most decorated soldier of WW2, as I recall. I disliked the M16 in Vietnam, as I was there during the unreliability period of bad ammo, and I purchased an M2 carbine from an ARVN soldier. Worked well for me. And a 1911 on the hip also.

    1. @ Paul russell sr.

      Audie Murphy, also fought with the M1 Garand too. And nowhere in his Bio’s does it mention, the he preferred the M1 Carbine over the M1 Garand Rifle. He also fought with the M1928 Thompson Submachine Gun, too.

    2. Sec,

      I read Murphy’s autobiography “To Hell and Back” many, many years ago and while I don’t remember specifics, I always thought he was partial to the carbine. After you posted your comment, I found a short bio at a WWII site that had this quote in it:

      “The blast shattered the stock of his lucky carbine (which he wired back together), but his own injuries were only minor.”

      That would indicate to me that he had a special relationship to the carbine…or at least to that particular carbine. Later on in the story it mentions him using his “trusty” M1 Garand. The full biography can be found here.

      http://www.americainwwii.com/articles/audie-murphy-a-life-larger-than-legend/

      Guess it might be time to re-read “To Hell and Back.”

    3. @ Lenwood.

      I is rumored that Charles Drake, the actor, and in the movie “To Hell And Back”. Was actually an OSS agent during WW2.

    4. @ Lenwood.

      It looks like my earlier response to you got dumped, when the system Locked-Up. So i’ll have to rewrite it for memory.

      My father served under General Mark Clark, as upstart 2nd Lieutenant. Just before the North Africa Campaign in 1942 CE. My father was issued an M1 Carbine, and look at it, and responded to Master of Arms in the Quartermaster Section. “What the Hell Is This, A God-Dammed Cap Gun”. Unperturbed by my father’s pithy statement, issued said Carbine to my father. Now, my father was 5-Feet 11-Inches Tall and the Carbine from the Butt Stock to the end of the Barrel, barely reached his Nuts, his words, not mine. He tried in vein attempts to trade his Brand New US. Army Issue Cap Gun, with his fellow officers and troopers. He even went as far as tossing his Cap Gun under the Tracks of a Sherman Tank, just to get-ride of it. Low-And-Behold, when he tried to get a new Rifle, they, the US> Army issue him another Cap Gun. Buy this time, he was thoroughly perturbed and disgusted with the US. Army Quartermaster Section. He asked his Battalion CO, if there was anything the CO could do about it. And the Battalion Co, responded in his stylish pithy statement, “Its Your Problem, Deal With It”. By this point my father was contemplating more drastic measures. Like take a Re-Issued Under New Management German Issue “Potato Masher” Hand Grenade and placing his Brand New US. Army Issued Cap Gun on the grenade, w/all of ammunition and Blow-It Up. But, after cooling down somewhat and getting drunk, too. It came to him take were going to reissue him a Brand New Cap Gun. So he sat down on the Running Board of a M3 Halftrack, and thought for a while. Then it came too him like a Bolt of Lightning, A Message From God, Himself. He got up , slowly maneuvered his way as stealthily as possible through a brunch of sleeping troopers, and swapped his Brand New US. Army Issued Cap Gun with a Well Used M1 Garand Rifle and all of his 30.06 ammunition. The Newt day the Battalion ask my father where he got his Semi-Used M1 Garand Rifle and what happed too his Brand New US. Army Issued M1 Carbine. So like any Well Disciplined College Educated Commissioned 2nd Lieutenant. He Lied His Ass Off. Not asking my father any further questions, the CO turned around and walked away laughing as he went. And my father kept that M1 Garand, through the Sicily campaign, Italian and Anzio through Rome to the Gothic/Green Line campaigns into Yugoslavia as well. He doesn’t know what happened to that poor private, and had too explain to his CO. What happen to his M1 Garand Rifle and how he woke-up with, and got a Pristine Never Fired Brand New US. Army Issued M1 Carbine, instead.

    5. @ Paul russell sr

      Actually it take’s Hollywood to Screw Up the Location of Audie Murphy MOH. It was on 26 January 1945 near Holtzwihr, France while fighting with the 15th Infantry.

  43. In Vietnam they were issued to the ARVN troops, G.I’s modified them by cutting stock off like a pistol grip, cutting barrel about 3″ in front ot action and they would fit in the cargo pocket fairly well of your fatigues…we carried them when we went on in country r&r for personal protection, it wasn;t very accurate but when a 30 rd mag was in it and you started pulling trigger the resulting muzzle flash scared the hell out of any vc or “cowboy” trying to rob you…good memories.

  44. I BROUGHT MY UNIVERSAL .30 CAL CARBINE AT A GUN SHOW IN AMARILLO, TX IN 1976 WITH 200PLUS MILITARY ROUNDS IN CLOTH BANDELERS FOR $90.S
    I AM A POLICE OFFICER AND CARRY IT IN MY CAR ON DUTY TO THIS DAY.
    I PUT A SCOPE ON IT YEARS AGO AND USE IT FOR HUNTING DEER
    (I SHOT 3 DEER ONE DAY AS THEY WERE RUNNING AND MY BUDDY KEPT YELLING SHOOT HIM HERE HERE HERE…..I STOPPED SHOOTING AND ASK HIM WHY AM I MISSING SO MUCH, HIS REPLY WAS ‘YOU SHOT THREE DEER WITH ONE SHOT EACH.)
    I LOVE MY CARBINE

    1. When we invaded Panama there were several members of the battalion staff standing behind cover as bullets were pinging all around them. The enemy was between 75 and 100 meters away, firing from inside buildings. The staff guys were standing there with disgusted looks on their faces, looking at the M9 pistols in their hands as if someone had handed them a piece of dried up dog poop. Later comments were along the lines of, “What jackass thought giving us pistols was a brilliant idea,” and ,” I can’t believe I fell for this stupid idea of carrying a pistol.” Everyone of them would have paid good money to have an M1 carbine instead of a pistol.
      _Retired Infantry First Sergeant

  45. @ Mel Morganstein.

    I know this is going to be a Long-Shot of a Question. But, ask you brother Ansel whether or not he ever heard of or knew Marine Corp Corporal Tony Stein.

    Corporal Tony Stein, field modified a T33 (e.i. AN/M2 or Lightweight 1919A4/6 Stinger, 7.62x63mm/.30-caliber, with a cyclic rate of fire of between 1,200-rpm to 1,500-rpm Aerial Machine Gun), by adding a BAR1918 Bipod and a rear section stock of an M1 Garand Rifle. To make a Marine Corps version of German MG34 Heavy Machine Gun.

    Corporal Tony Stein, received the Medal of Honor (Posthumously) fighting the Imperial Japanese Army on Iwo Jima.

  46. While I don’t have any experience with .30 carbine rifles – I have much experience with a Ruger Blackhawk .30 carbine pistol and let me tell you – that .30 carbine Ruger is exceptionally accurate. Over 20 years ago, when I was young, dumb, and full of crum – My buddies and I used to set 12 gauge shotgun shells on their sides with the shot end pointing away from us and we would shoot our pistols(mine was 45 ACP) at the shotgun shells trying to set them off. We were 50ft away, and let me tell you – I could hit the shotgun shells and set set them off quite regularly with my buddies .30 carbine pistol. As a matter of fact – it was the only pistol of the bunch that could hit the shogun shells with any regularity. Don’t ever try the stupid thing we did with the shotgun shells, but the .30 carbine Ruger Blackhawk is a damn fine accurate weapon. That .30 carbine pistol was way more accurate than my 45 ACP Colt 1911 was and is.

  47. I bought an M1 Carbine about a year ago from a friend (going through a very interesting interstate transfer process from where my friend lived in Kentucky to where I am in California). I already had an M1 Garand, but always liked the Carbine, and when my friend wanted to sell his, it was the time for me to act. Glad I did as its one of my favorite rifles in my collection.

    Mine is pretty much a mixture of parts from different manufacturers: Underwood barrel & receiver, Penderson stock, etc.) with several 15-rd. magazines, a 30-rd. magazine, buttstock magazine pouch, and vintage cleaning kit. Upon getting the rifle, I saw it hadn’t been properly cleaned in something like 20 years, so I had to field strip it and remove a good deal of built up grease, cosmoline, and a spot of surface corrosion on the barrel…

    The gun shoots beautifully, I am able to get 4-6 inch groupings at 50 yards once the sights are adjusted – a range that I found to be its most effective (like the author in the above article). Funny thing was that when I first went to shoot it, I tried to be a “good boy” and use a newly manufactured 10-round magazine made by Auto Ordinance (only 10 round and smaller magazines are legal in CA). From the first shot, the ammo had trouble feeding, so I switched to one of the vintage magazines, which worked perfectly.

    I’ve been very happy with my M1 Carbine. I keep it handy as a personal defense weapon and it always draws compliments when I take it out to the range. Its nice to be able to shoot and change a magazine without the use of a bullet button and fun to have a piece of history in my gun collection.

  48. I have a Universal .30 carbine and I love it. It is not the most accurate rifle in my collection but it is a hoot to shoot! I reload all my ammo and the brass seems to take to many loads before discarding. 14 grains of H110 works great with just about any manufacture 110 gr. FMJ. Since the cases head space on the case mouth, the most important thing is to make sure the cases are not any longer than 1.29 in. They will fail to operate properly. It is not expensive to load and a lot of fun.

  49. I have had two original M1 Carbines over time. The first was a DCM $24 one from the 1960 era sale. It was an Underwood with all the late features. It was also the time when cans of 600 rounds of carbine ammunition could be had from the DCM for 4 cents a round. Needless to say that Carbine had had a lot of rounds through it. I inherited it from my Dad and now my oldest Nephew has it. I have bought and sold a couple of others over time. The one I have now is an I.B.M. that has all the WWII features. I would feel fairly armed with it for defense. Yes, the ctg. is less powerful than the M1 Garand’s but until the demise of the horse cavalry an infantryman’s rifle had to use a cartridge that could drop a charging horse. Now there are no more horses to stop, its power is not needed. People are ornery and just don’t behave like you wish even with lots of bullets in and through their bodies. When you are in fear of your life, there is no such thing as “overpowered” in a cartridge. However even a .25 ACP kills. As with all things regarding bullets in bodies, placement is paramount. If you can shoot the Carbine well and put the projectiles in the right place, it works. A .600 Nitro Express would probably be a sure “stopper” unless you miss!

    Lastly, according to his own book and two biographies I have read, Audie Murphy carried a Carbine by preferrence for most of his time in action. He did in a lot of his enemies with it but then he was a top shot.

    1. Well said, History Nut, never heard that argument before and it makes a sense.. Precision is the keyword – An accurate .22 is more lethal than an errant cannon ball. There was such a high percentage of enemy combatants dying with head wounds in Iraq that they investigated it for fear of executions. Turned out the only shot you often got in the city was at a head peeking around a corner, over a wall. Unless you have actually been fired at do you realize that you spend little time attempting to identify the caliber of the weapon to ascertain it’s deadliness as your attention is fully occupied trying to disappear into the ground so you can safely return fire. Additionally, with the M1 you could carry almost three times the ammo, fire 3 1/2 times as long without reloading (30 rd mag) and put a lot of lead downrange in a short time – which is how you establish fire superiority.

  50. The US supplied the Carbine to evrry piss poy dictator or CIA groups in Latin America, it and 45;grease guns eere favorites of US Bay of Pigs losers.
    WHRN WE invaded DOM rep we confiscated evrry eeapon on that sidr of Idlanf and when ee lefy yheir police had M’1 carbines.
    In SE Asia in Laos , Cambodia snd bietnam and Thailanf And them Burma Drug and Ear lordsgot free of charge M-1 Carbines to lil commies with.
    The Viet molitary personell werrindeed the little people and Yards and Hmoung hill tribes smaller yet. And they got free Varbines tp shoot commies as well
    Mamy of our alternative tactics advisors packed select fire Carbines anf our Hill Tribe Srike forces we tried to get all full auto carbines or 45 cals H&R Greas and Thompsons.
    Reason was that if we were ambushed or ville attacked in esrly days of VC
    were mainly armed old French rifles , junk and chicom Sk’s and 7.62 54 bolts, and we we could quicky gain fire supetiority.
    S VIET MILITARY GRUNT LIKED THE CARBINE VERY MUCH AND IN FACT UNTIL END OF WAR THEY WERE STILL IN SEVICE IN SOME AREAS.
    In that climate rust was big enrmy and corrosion of US military Surplus Ammo was from Korean War era but cannot remember when mud rain or grungy ammo jammed a Carbine.
    Hell sometimes we boiled and used penut oil to lube.
    Like I said A historical weapon that is fun to shoot and if Zombies were real I would make sure I had a bayonet on mine.

  51. Thanks Bob,

    I enjoyed your article. I agree the M1 carbine was the FIRST, and the one that set the trend, to these shorter, lighter, carbines with less recoil than a battle rifle.

    My uncles loved this little carbine in WW2.

    One of my regrets was when I passed up a new manufactured M1 in stainless steel and in 30 carbine. It looked like an exact copy and it was only $200. I have kicked myself every time I think of that gun. If I remember right, it was made by Iver Johnson. That was almost 30 years ago.

  52. OK, I do love my National Postal Meter M1 carbine. Yes I also Love my M1 Garand for long shots, and furthermore my 30-30 and 45 Colt lever actions. They all have a specific place and purpose. M1 carbine, excellent home defense in a urban area. Just my opinion, and I welcome each reader to form their own opinion.
    Thank you.

  53. Would like to bring aytention to copies and varients .
    Both Universal and Iver Johnson had M1 Carbines in pistol form that were quite popular
    ERMA MADE A DAMN CLOSE LOOK ALIKE IN 22 CAOnce owned both Universal and Ivers with heavily chromed and with gold trimmings.
    Know of yet two Universal Carbine Enforcers pistols , heard of more, both chambered in 256 Winchester.
    Far as I know they are not for sale.
    For a few years Rugers eRly revolvers fired that round( actually I think Ruger developed and Win bought it up; Marlin and TC can be found chambered for it but finding 256 win Mag in a Carbine in pistol form is rare. THEY DID SOME RIFLES AS WELL AND AT ONE TIME I THINK THEY TRIED TO SELL USAF ON THE ENFORCER PISTOL IN EITHRR CALIBER BUT USAF WENT 22HORNET CARBINE A D LATER DUMPED IT.
    seen full autos in action and have seen many crank/trigger fired dual and quad gatling guns as well using universal carbines.
    Neat toy with historical value = fun day plinking but be carefull as for some damned reason women pick one up and ya gotta damn near wrestle it away from their clutches

    1. @ Hide Behind.

      At least the M1 Carbine and AK-47 have one thing in common. Beyond 200-meters, you’d be lucky to hit your sighted target.

    2. “At least the M1 Carbine and AK-47 have one thing in common. Beyond 200-meters, you’d be lucky to hit your sighted target.”

      Hogwash! I’ve a lifetime of experience with the AK platform both in combat and as a civilian owner. If a shooter cannot hit a man-sized stationary target at 300 meters with an AK, the problem is with the shooter, not the weapon.

    3. @ JD MAK.

      Back around 1999/2000, a friend of mine bought himself a Norinco Type-56 (AK-47 Chinese Copy) Assault Rifle for around $500. USD and equally expensive scope. Because he thought it would make him look cool. I looked a him, as he was crazy as a loon, and told him he was nuts! We found a old dilapidated farm barn deep in the Virginia boonies. The barn measured approximately 60-feet per side-to-side.
      We then place a man-sized cut-out against the barn wall, then proceeded to pace out approximately 300-meters, plus/minus 10-feet or so. Then my friend sighted his target. And to show me his expert marksmanship by blasting away with two 30-round magazines. Would you believe it, but he didn’t even come close to hitting the cut-out. Hell, he didn’t even hit the barn. Then he was stupid enough, to tell me their something wrong with the rifle, and he was going to sue the gun shop owner. Just to keep him quiet for the rest of the day. He and I, walked back to the shooter’s spot. I removed the scope, and just using the iron sights, was able to group 7-rounds in and around the groin area and the knee caps. And I was aiming at a point just above the head. Then I proceeded to the him It wasn’t the gun that was off target, but that it was him that was off target. At least I was Army trained to fire a weapon, he wasn’t trained to fire a squirt gun, much less a real gun. Then he tried in vein too sell me the Rifle/Scopte combo for $1,200. USD. $200. USD, more then he paid for it. I told him he was crazy and nuts, in Yiddish. And, I’m not even Jewish.

    4. @ Herbet.

      If given to a well trained shooter, the AK-47/Type-56, is a good shooting weapon. But when the Russian/ChiCom’s were handing them out like free candy in a candy store. The people they handed them too couldn’t shoot a Bulls Eye a Point Blank Range. It was like the WW2 Soviet ppsh-41 Sub-Maching Gun. All they expected from you is to Point and Shoot. It was extremely unlikely that your weren’t going hit anything at close range. But, hand over a AK-47/Type-56 and ask them to shoot at a distant target, that was a different story. Your typical rebel would be lucky to hit and/or kill someone at 50-meters. But, beyond 250-meters, using iron sights. “Not Without A Wing And A Prayer From God Him/Herself”, And his/her divine finger at the trigger. It was never going to happen!

    5. I have one of the Iver Johnson branded Erma EM-1 22 LR carbines. It is one of the sweetest shooting 22’s I have ever shot. It is an older model with the fifteen round magazine. I would have no problem putting it up against a 10/22 for accuracy. The only problems with these little carbines are the receivers and operating rods are made from cast aluminum. The operating rods are notorious for breaking just ahead of the charging handle just from the stress of charging the carbine and riding back and forth with the bolt each time it fired. It also rides in a dove tail machined into the side of the receiver, and the lips have a tendency to chip and break due to work hardening. The operating rods can be fixed with a drill press and a piece of “all thread”. I have two repaired operating rods!

  54. @ CTD: The .30-Carbine, the Original Personal Defense Weapon.

    Is there a hidden message in the the title that I can’t see, Do I have to hold it up to a mirror to see or find the hidden meaning. The Only thing I’ve determined is, that the .30 Carbine (7.62x33mm), when fired with a 30-round magazine, Allows you too get close enough to your victim, that you can use the carbine stock as a war club. Too bloodjinn your victim to death, because the wimpish ammunition sure isn’t going to do the job. So please CTD, tell me where the hidden meaning is.

    1. Hi Secundius,

      I don’t think the message was hidden at all. The M1 carbine was the first of the lightweight, shorter, carbines with less recoil that many could handle better than the Garand. It was not to replace a battle rifle, but was better in many situations than a pistol.

      The German and Russian carbines followed. The first is often not the best. For everyone that follows can learn from it’s mistakes. So the Carbines that followed had cartridges with more power.

      But my uncles, who served in WW2, both loved this little carbine. And they earned the right to their opinion by seeing many of their buddies buried over there.

    2. @ Lou.

      My father received his M1 Carbine, aboard ship, prior to land of the beaches of North Africa in the second week of May 1942. He told me, he threw his under the tracks of a moving Sherman, to avoid doing the paper work needed to be reissued a new rifle. And to his surprise and consternation, the US Army issued him another one. Disgusted with Army at this point, for not giving him the rifle he wanted. He took upon himself, and unwary a sleeping private, and proceeded to swap the privates M1 Garand and ammunition, for his M1 Carbine and ammunition. And let the private explain too the Army on what happen to his Rifle. My father was a 1st Lieutenant at the time of the incident. And kept that M1 Garand Rifle through the end of war, somewhere in Yugoslavia, as a brevet Lieutenant Colonel under General Mark Clark command.

    3. @ Lou.

      I tend to think of the M1 Carbine (7.62x33mm) as Artillery Pistol or an extended-range, .38 Special. Which similar characteristics of the .38 Special (9.1x29R or 9.1×29.5R). But, longer-ranging.

    4. My older brother Ansel (we just celebrated his 88th birthday) signed up,for the U.S. Marine Corps in 1943. He was in the 5th Marine Division at Iwo Jima and his M1 Garand served him well when the 5th took Mt. Suribachi! He saw both American flags being erected at its peak! Out of 100 men in his company, 7 were able to,walk off the island
      He was also in the invasion force to land on the home island of Japan and was afraid the Garand might not keep him alive this time around. They were told to expect 100% casualties! luckily we were able to!end the war without what was going to be a real bloodbath!
      He was called back a few years later for Korea where he took part in the Inchon invasion! His M1 Garand and his Marine buddies somehow helped keep him alive through the battles of Chosin Reservoir. He will NOT talk about that, but we have him today! Mel Morganstein

    5. @ Mel Moganstein.

      I have great respect for you and your brother Ansel. For his heroic stand and bravery on Iwo Jima against the Imperial Japanese and the Chsin Reservoir Battle against the ChiCom’s. Like your brother Ansel. My father and two of his brothers also fought in WW2. My father under General Mark Clark in North Africa, Sicily, Anzio,and Yugoslavia campaigns. One of the brothers, 4th oldest fought on Guadalcanal with the US. Army. And his youngest brother, was a Ball-Turret Gunner with the 8th US. Army Air Force in England. And on my mother’s side of the family. Her father was forced- conscripted into the German Army and fought at the Siege of Stalingrad campaign. And one of her sisters husband, was a 2nd officer on a German U-Boat in the Mid-Atlantic. A colorful family, right. I served in the US. Army under the draft, but never got to Vietnam. I worked on and maintain Bell AH-1S Cobra Attack Helicopters. I, also own two M1 Garand rifles,. One is a M1E5 Tanker/Garand Rifle and the other is a M1E6 Sniper/Garand Rifle. I use too shoot the M1E6 rifle a lot, But, now that I’m in a wheelchair, I shoot the M1E5. Because it is easier to handle while being in a wheelchair. I’m trying to acquire a Mauser 98k carbine/rifle in WW2 vintage. Preferably one used in or near the fighting at Stalingrad. I don’t think my chances are going to be all that great.

    6. Where have you been the last 20 years or so–Russian reworked capture mausers have been on the market for 20 years, though most by now probably have had the import stamp carefully removed and now are war capture rifles. The Russians captured and refurb for use and capture implies war use.

    7. @ Herbert.

      Up until mid-2012, I never own and/or had access to a computer. It wasn’t until that time, while I was in the Hospital Recovery from a Stroke I had. That a friend of mine, got me a Chrome Notebook Computer. Because my Neurologist told me to keep my mind active, because he was afraid that I might have another Stroke in the coming months. Up until then all my knowledge has been reading a lot of books and magazines. After I was released from the hospital, my doctor told too join any many discussion groups as I could stand. So, I did. I’m up too at least 20, or more discussion group at the moment. The problem I facing right now, is other peoples lack of interest, or just don’t what to get into a sparring match-up with me. And the discussion group shuts down, and then I try too find another one of any interest too me.

      The Mauser company you mentioned to me, I had no knowledge of. The only one I was aware of is Mitchell’s Mauser’s. And truth be told, I’m trying to get my bearings on the operational side of using a computer and the geek speak that goes with, it.

      and another reason is, it take me a while to write my thoughts down into understandable coherent sentences. I’m also having trouble with my spelling as well. I went to UK-English speaking schools growing up, so I’m more comfortable with the UK-English spelling. I’m not use tot thinking in, or writing in American-English. So, be patient with me.

    8. Secundius – Good for you! It takes a lot of courage to jump onto a computer late in life, and yes, it can be frustrating. I’m about the same age as you appear to be and I started in late 2010. I would recommend getting a notebook to dedicate to new tasks and procedures you encounter on your PC, but because sometimes you won’t use them for so long that you can forget where you accessed them or the proper steps to take it is a good idea to have a reference. I struggled a lot, but it does get easier as you go along. You’d be surprised how many people who are ‘online’ actually have very little overall computer knowledge and are proficient in only the one or two areas they are interested in. My biggest source of knowledge was when I started just asking the computer (basically just Google or Bing! it) – in search terms – what to do in a particular situation if I didn’t know how to do it.
      Then read over several of the forums or articles to learn what you can. Remember – there are probably no problems that you will encounter that thousands of previous students of the computer haven’t had to deal with, so the answer is there – You just got to find it! Good luck in your endeavors and KEEP ON TRUCKIN’!

  55. I have one of the Universals and it is afun accuaratelittle gum. Used mostly for plinking but I ddi take i ton a whitetail hunt in the Chiricahuas one tiem with some pet handloads. No accomodating deer on that trip I htink it would work well on javelina.
    I see many have disdain for the 30 Carbine as a stopper, yet the 7.62X25 Tokarev cartridge.as used in the PPsh 41 and ChiiCom Type 50 had inferior velocity with a somwhat lighter bullet and it was generally well thought of both in WWII and the Korean War:

    “Though relatively inaccurate, the Chinese PPSh had a high rate of fire and was well-suited to the close-range firefights that typically occurred in that conflict, especially at night. U.N. forces in defensive outposts or on patrol often had trouble returning a sufficient volume of fire when attacked by companies of infantry armed with the PPSh. Some U.S. infantry officers ranked the PPSh the best combat weapon of the war: while lacking the accuracy of the U.S. M1 Garand or M1 carbine, it provided more firepower at short distances. As infantry captain (later general) Hal Moore, stated: “on full automatic it sprayed a lot of bullets and most of the killing in Korea was done at very close ranges and it was done quickly – a matter of who responded faster. In situations like that it outclassed and outgunned what we had. A close-in patrol fight was over very quickly and usually we lost because of it.” Other US servicemen, however, felt that their M2 carbines were superior to the PPSh-41 at the typical engagement ranges of 100–150 meters.”

    1. I neglected to mention I use Thunderbird Catridge Co T680 powder to reload this round. This is (I believe) repackaged military WC680 powder and I have read is the same as AA1680. Functioning was fine at either 16.0 or 16.5 grains.
      The Universal did have one annoying habit in that the last round in the mag would self ‘eject’ after the 2nd to last round was ejected but that seems to have been a magzine problem.

  56. A time in past when during the wee hours at a local saloon or pub; it was after barflys and barmaids sent home, and the owner himself was serving and drinking as well; it was then the time of wars past From Spanish to Korea came to perch above us all
    Odd but in its seriousness there was not so much mourning; but more a celebration of life,, more like an Irish Wake with pollocks anf Italian guest, whereby a sip was taken in toast of a departed and of a happy time he once sjared with them..
    Oh the M1 carbine is coming along and it was my step dad who was the outside guest of his much respected father-in-law, my grandfather, and all these men who had known each other most of thrir lives.
    I was just a stout lad knowm as a grandson to me step-dads father in laws, that seemed like was welcomed in any salloons pubs and social
    Clubs gramps was.
    I heard stories of mens trials and some were bordering on depravity but looking at my gramps he would nod and I knew the man spoke true
    Me step was a small man who when not drunk was a good man, but much to mild for those of rough plain speaking men that lived in New Englands brawling dehimanizing mill towns and
    outdoor occupations.
    Was on our third such visit that thenM1Carbine storyvof step dad came out.
    I had known the story but only because he told me when im his cups.A man adked Step what he had done in Korea , It was and still is a matter of clan pride to of derved, so Gramps told him totell. STEP just pushed it aside and ordered another round.
    It was when n someone mumbled , he must of been a REMF That I broke my Gramps rule of never speaking until asked and blurtedvout to Gramps “”Ask him to show you the pucker marks and tell how he got them”
    Gramps was only man Step ever realy respected and when asked he stood in light of pool table and this 5’3″ man of slender buildvshpwed where two bayonets had gone clear through him.
    He told of freezing snow and laying his M1 on the trench top to try and kerp feet and hands warm from thre blowing white no visability and then ; the sudden appearance of hundreds of Chi Coms in front of him.
    He said he remembers grabbing up the carbine,
    And he knows he hit the s.o.b. at least three times before he seen the puffs of coat he wore shed fabric,
    Then he felt pain as the bastard stuck him to
    the ground and stuck him again..
    Then the S.O.B climbef out of trench and Step Grabbed his Carbine and emptied it into the bastards back and ass.
    Then he got ready and waited until the chicoms retreated right back over his position and kept going..
    So when anyone tells me how fn great an M1 carbine is; I always want to ask ” after how many rounds” ?.
    Still Step preferred packing it to what he called a heavy club, the Garand.
    Two wars and same weapon he went from USAAF then as “Brownshoe” USAF.
    Oh and the decendents of those men, now sit in the same salloon and pubs into the wee hours, and after the barmaids and barflys be gone the wars comes back, and they pour a wee siip for
    those no longer here.

  57. Something that was not covered enough, was the fact that there were so many aftermarket junks made. Do your homework online and compare them before you buy and rely. many of the older Plainfieds and some others actually can use original parts and such. These are usually the better buy. The gypsy stuff that followed not so much. They are relatively as easy to find as the junk, so shop a little and the price is not much higher either. Worth the homework for sure.

  58. I also have a Plainfield, and got it when I was eleven. It was the only deer rifle I had until I was an adult, and it took it’s fair share of deer. It obviously has sentimental value, but it’s like everyone else says, it just really fun to shoot. It’s called a carbine because it’s a carbine. A portable rifle with a shorter barrel, and for what it was designed for, it fit perfect. I’d much rather have an M1 carbine than the alternative, a 1911. Especially within 50 yards, with it’s sight radius and 15 round magazine.

  59. # larry.

    I just thought of it. You might try a outfitter like Red Jacket in New Orleans, to CNC-machine a receiver to accommodate either a standard .308-Winchester (7.62x51mm Nato) Box Magazine or try machining a .30-06 (7.62x63mm Sprnfld) Box Magazine for, you. And see if they can do it using AISA-SAE E01 Steel or “Tool Steel”. It’s just a suggestion.

    1. Thanks again Sec, but my high power, long range needs are more than covered with my M1A, 308 and my Garand, 30-06. Both are superbly accurate at any range but a bit over the top close in. The carbine would suit my purpose very well.

  60. @ Larry.

    Happy I could help. I have (2) M1 Garand’s myself, 1) The M1E5 “Tanker” model and 2) The M1E6 “Sniper” model. And I love them both.

  61. @ Larry.

    You can go to either Springfield Armory Civilian Marksmanship Program, or go on a “Scavenger Hunt” and try to find a half way decent rifle through back channel hunt.

    Or, just look up a the parts, required to produce a M1 Garand. And build one yourself, think of it as a model kit and start putting the pieces together. That way if anything breaks, you’ll know where to get the replacement parts from.

    1. Thanks Sec, I will look into building one as well as hunt for one. Once upon a time, a couple of decades ago, I tried to buy a Garand from CMP. That was one of the worst experiences of my life. Every one I spoke with was very unfriendly. In my search to find one of those rifles in decent condition, I came across a Springfield Garand, brand new, in the box, at a little store in Fairbanks, AK. For $1200.00. I own it now.

  62. It is such a beautiful little rifle. Wouldn’t you just love to see that platform with a purpose cartridge. Like maybe if someone manufactured a M1 in a 30/30 or a 44 Magnum… Oh wait Ruger did and discontinued it. Yeah a M1 carbine in a detachable 44 magnum box magazine. That would be a great little rifle. I know people will say that market is covered in lever actions but I still think it would be a popular gun.

  63. Thank you for the information. I have been considering a lever rifle in 45LC or 44mag for my 100yd and in targets. You article has certainly given me another option to consider.

    1. I agree it’s better than a lever action, but I’d rather have an AK than an old obsolete 30 carbine.

    2. @ ss1.

      Sandy Gun Works of Sandy, Oregon has a 5.7×28 M1 Carbine called the “5.7 Johnson Spitefire” with a claimed range of about 600-meters and a M1 Carbine in the works, to chamber the 7.92×33 Kurz.

    3. @1 ab urbe condita:

      Haha, I wasn’t too nice with the 30 carbine in 2014, was I?

      Thanks for the tip. I think Secundius mentioned the 5.7×2.8 carbine this past week in a more recent forum, but maybe your comment made me really take notice. I just now found the website and saved it, and I’ll study it later. Right now I gotta get out of my house and go to the shooting range and maybe the desert. Have a good day!

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