There are plenty of amazing guns out there. However, have you ever wondered what people are actually buying? It may, or may not, surprise you that not everyone buys a $2,000 fully decked out Knights Armament AR-15. Our most common sellers are usually home defense shotguns, semi-automatic .22s, and .380 pistols. I pulled our sales data from the last six months and made an interesting discovery. A relatively obscure shotgun is outselling the rest of the guns we sell by a large margin. The Interstate Arms Hawk Model 982 literally flies off the shelves and we have a hard time keeping them in stock. It is currently our number one selling firearm. This is due in no small part to its very low price tag—but how does it measure up in quality and performance?
The short answer is that it is brilliant. It does a great job of doing exactly what the manufacturer intended it to do, which is to be a rugged home defense gun. This shotgun is simply a Chinese made Remington 870 clone manufactured by Norinco and imported by Interstate Arms.
Actually, copy is a better term than clone. The word clone implies that it is precisely the same in every way. However, not all aftermarket parts are interchangeable with the 870. For instance, an 870 sidesaddle may fit just fine, although a barrel exchange will not work without adapters.
The 982 model comes with ghost ring sights pre-installed. Some ghost ring sights will cost you half the price of this whole setup, so imagine my surprise when I found out they were included. I decided to try to find out where Norinco cut their corners. It is a Chinese reproduction, so it cannot be as good as a real Remington 870 Express, right? I inspected the receiver half expecting to see aluminum; it was steel, just like the Remington. Norinco machined the extractor and ejector instead of using MIM parts like the Express, which is an improvement. The trigger guard was also metal instead of the plastic stuff Remington stuck on their gun. The action was a little rough at first, although after a few hundred rotations, the gun polished itself down to an action just as smooth as the 870. The gun shouldered well, and when firing, I really could not tell any difference between it and the Remington.
Norinco managed to make a reproduction as good as the original, at a fraction of the cost. While I usually try to buy American, I forced myself to come to this conclusion: If you are on a budget and need something to protect your family, this IA Hawk 982 is really an amazing deal.
If you are not on a budget, this makes a great knock around gun. I would have no qualms about chunking this thing behind the seat of the farm truck or taking it out in the elements for some muddy training. While the shorter barrel is not ideal for bird hunting, the 982 fits snugly in the role of home defense, range toy, or random critter exterminator.
Specifications and Features
- 12 gauge
- 18.5-inch barrel
- 3-inch chamber
- 5 round capacity
- Polymer stock
- Matte black finish
- Machined, solid steel receiver
- Adjustable ghost ring sights
- 38.5 inches in overall length
- Weighs 7 pounds
What are your thoughts on the IAC Hawk 982? Share in the comments section.
The barrel is smooth bore
This is a smooth bore shotgun and it’s a hefty piece of metal…not going to argue politics…it shoots well, action smooths out the more you shoot, solid chunk of steel…I likes it!
Is the barrel smooth bore or rifled? Would make a difference with sabot rounds. Could anyone answer this for me?
I would just like to say it is a pity they aer made in China, is there anyway in the near future we could have them made in the US or Canada? As a responsible Gun Owner and Law abiding Citizen I just would also like to know if you know other Gun Owners who are Canadian, as I am, they need to sign the petition against Bill C-71 which the Trudeau Gov’t is trying to clamp down even more on responsible Gun Owners and make it easier for us to beome targets for the criminals who of course do not obey the law and obtain them illegally. Thank you so much and have a wonderful day.
I bought one sometime around ’07/08. Since then, I’ve fired it hundreds of times and put it away dirty more often than not. I treat it like a cheap, red-headed, chi-com step-brother and in return it just. keeps. banging. every. friggin’. time. Not one misfire or miss-feed so far. Tough to beat flawless function at a low price point. Made in China…so F-ing what? This is one product the chi-coms hit out of the park.
When and IF I buy a Hawk 982 shotgun, it will be because I want a decent shotgun, as opposed to an opinion of “my country is better than your country”. Besides, the Chinese already OWN most of America anyway. I am from Texas and we are friendly to everyone except for bad guys. For that we let well-made shotguns from China or the US sound the only opinions the bad guys need to hear.
This is as good as an 870 absent the slightest bit of doubt for far less cash which obviously is a key variable for most shooters–some remain suspect of such but I would recommend they do their own homework and then report back…heck get both the 870 and 981/2 if possible, the more the merrier (compare/contrast)…
Now, IMO the ‘self-righteous” outcries critical of 981/2 owners solely because they are built in “Red China” (yes I recognize Free-China AKA Taiwan) are comical…those very same people mocking Norinco owners are living amongst countless consumer items within their very household ranging from electronics to toys and everything in between…For those that abide by a strict discipline of “Red-Chinese-Abstinence” in totality please disregard and kudos (note I have yet to meet one single American that has successfully avoided such even when making a concerted effort).
BTW, where does it end…? Do we not but forearms from Turkey, Serbia, Bulgaria, Romania, (Eastern Europe @large) Russia etc…Oh, and don’t check that S&W M&P 22 that was made in Germany…;). And don’t open up this can of worms that inevitably next leads to Ammo…
Great article. I appreciate your perspective, thanks. We live on a very tight budget, and as such I am very interested in one of these as my first and likely only shotgun for home defense. Any thoughts on reliability? The local gunsmith by me said he had a couple of Chinese shotguns blow up in the face of his gunsmith and he would never sell them, which makes me concerned. But I have not read any similar concerns anywhere else. Also, is it single or dual extractor? Thanks.
America is based on capitalism, not communism. Therefore, we import things for purchase just like all free 1st world countries. We have the FREEDOM to purchase things from anyone we darn well please. Only Communists want to force people to only buy from state-sponsored companies, so if you hate the idea of free market economies and think people should only buy from certain places then you should stop whining here and just move to a Communist country where your ideals are law. But before you go, have a look at some of the labels around your house, where the things you have bought have been made. I’m willing to bet more than a few will say “MADE IN CHINA”. So if you’re whining about “supporting a communist country” then you need to put a cork in it until you can figure out how to explain your hypocrisy and ignorance to your fellow freedom-loving Americans. We’ll wait for you, so you can catch up on things. 🙂
I’ve bought many AMERICAN firearms, etc. BUT I do feel (no,know) that I and the American people have been and are being ripped off and used by the very democracy live and fight for. Based on our current financial and healthcare situations I am ready to purchase firearm and other life products at a price I have been forced to afford. So, I am looking for an affordable, usable 12 shotgun – without my own government allowing me to be screwed by my own patriots. I’m 64 and a Vietnam WAR navy seal vet, so I don’t want to others crying about THEIR service!!!
This seems to be a great value so it might be good to buy a few, shrink-wrap and bury them to be used when the CCA APC’s start rolling through your neighborhood … It’s a bit late to whine over the fact that they are coming …
I just bought one of these shotguns . I own two import guns now . This badass 12ga and a mosin m44. All my other guns are made in the USA . When it comes to a home defense shotgun I wasn’t willing to pay double or triple for a mossberg 500 or Remington 870. This IAC is all I needed and a great value . It will see range time but mostly be kept for home defense. Has anybody noticed the famous H&R protector is made in china too ? They are just as popular as this gun but with a USA name . So whoever wants to go spend the $ for a Remington or Mossy to serve the same purpose as this Hawk – more power to you .
to the #1 input candy ass. You are judging others while you yourself are guilty of buying chin/chinese/gook/russian… Think of all the pieces Plus the steel casing ammo & tell you haven’t shot it or don’t own it. I bought an Interstate hawk 981, exactly like a remington, however has a better heavier for the heat chamber. I didn’t know it was a gook when I bought it. Understand this little boy. When you were playing video games in the house, I spent two tours, right at two years, fighting the gooks. Let me know when you want some schooling loud mouth. Too, I’ve owned numerous gook sk’s & have a ruskie now. Your kind disgust me. Jim Perkins TN/OH
These comment sections are so entertaining. Started talking about the sales of the 982 and then it went into communism and religion. What ever happened to the days we all spent our time outside with our friends and family instead of sitting behind a computer screen? I say we all use the 982 to put a hole in the computer and then we go light up the BBQ and call some friends over……well at least turn off the computer, that way we can still have something to do on a rainy day…LOL…
Magnum6 post #9 over a year old. Its comical that you believe Christians are good people. Check your history on that one… Not to mention the fact that any religion is believable. Why you are googling ‘christian history’ Check out this new thing called science as well….
When I buy my 982 it will sit nicely next to my IJ-70 Russian made Makarov 9mm and my Harley Road King and if you think that the Harley is all American made you’d better think again. I’ll bet that some of the American flags that yall fly are Chinese made. Semper Fi!!! 64-70.
When I buy a 982 it will go right next to my IJ-70 Russian Makarov 9mm and my Harley Road King. If you think the Harley is completely American made, you’d better do some research.
Agree with #122. Whining Obamanites. Anyhow, hey CTD, is it possible for you guys to find parts for a Ishapore .308 ?
The way I see it, CTD is an important asset in bring consumers the best possible product the consumer is looking for. Chinese made, russian made, communisism, lol, i’ll bust a s**t storm of lead and steel in them all with anything of mine from m4, mossberg, s&w, sks, and others, if they bring it here. So to the whiners about where American’s firearms come from, lol, don’t sweat our business. We got this.
AJTexas, you really want to point fingers & bitch at folks who may buy Chinese guns when yourself are commenting your illogical whining online with a computer made outside the United States… VERY likely, built in this same Red regime China you cry about..?
Moron. … Do the math. *shakes head*
I also want to thank Cheaoer than dirt for allowin us to ask questions. You mentioned the Glocks as one of best sellers. How does the Judge 45/410 compare in sales to the best selling glock? From your stand point, which cal/ga ammos are the most popular for all of the ammo you sell? I was enamored by the fact the judge uses two types of ammo.
Are you guys comparing ideologies or guns. Because, if you are, you’re on the wrong forum. A good gun has nothing to do with political ideologies. And it just so happens that Communist countries do actually produce some pretty decent products.
End the Fed.
there have been a lot of those little carbines in pistol calibers showing up at our range lately . in fact they’ve even set up combat courses for the guys and gals to run with them .
That’s what freedom is all about… choice! You chose what products to buy and support , and I’ll chose mine. A wise man once told me… if we all liked the same thing, we’d all be married to the same wife!
Hey…..just want to say….thanks CHEAPERTHANDIRT for letting us gun owners get our 2 cents worth in on your website… this is what freedom is all about…keep up the good work…its so great to hear other gun owners opinions and feed back….
Sorry…..dont buy into those cheap chinese copyied firearms anymore !!!! Norinco is a communist chinese company !!!! remember early 90s when they flooded the american market with guns and cheap ammo …you get what you pay for…most of the time…clinton banned all those imports remember?… i have a chi-com sks that failed me horribly !!! still have the scar on my nose to show for it !!!! rifle cost me 69.oo dollars brand new !!! Have a norinco 1911 45 that i bought brand new that hasnt ever failed to work and shoot…but…what kind of unsafe metal was it made out of ?????….. no you can buy that crap from china if you want…but me I will buy from a well known firearms company…..
I don’t think it’s always up to the American consumer to buy American no matter the cost, but it helps. I try to do my part where I can. That being said I will never ever buy a Norinco product! I remember back when the Mac 90’s and SKS’s were flying off the shelves about ten years ago. Norinco was behind all those and I was about to get on board. Then I read an article, in SOF I believe, about how Norinco is a company that was started by the Chinese government! That means when you buy their products your money is going directly into the pocket of the red army! It may end up resembling an intercontinental fast and furious on when the first American is killed by a Chinese soldier with a weapon financed by the American gun owner. I’m out on that!
So much anger toward buying chinese. I happen to love general’s chicken and pot stickers the bomb!
Seriously though, blame your government for allowing outsourcing and giving tax breaks to companies that outsource. Blame your government for not properly taxing and tariffing imports. Blame your government for selling and allowing the sales of American land to the same nations that own our debt. Blame your government for spending so frivilously that our debt is what it is today.
If I had the opportunity to make a product for $20 and sell it in China for $200, I and any one of us would do it all day. China doesn’t allow this as openly as we do here. Our nation was hijacked years ago by multinational corporations through opportunistic and greedy politicians. Buying American only solves the problem if foreign imports are taxed enough to discourage production and sales to the American market.
But if you want real results, drag your local politician who is guilty of accepting campaign funs and allowing policies like these by the hair onto his front lawn and…you can figure out the rest. I recommend a fair trial for treason, but I also hate wasting tax dollars.
Remington 870 still the best and most reliable entry level shotgun known to man. Drag a glock through the mud and it will still fire. Mosin…yeah, but boring. Ruger is the 870 of rifles. Overall great article.
If you have to go with an import shotgun i like the turkish ones. They use a good steel, and have excellent fit, finish and function. Yes they worship Allah but at least they don’t have nukes pointed at us.
At Magnum6 not saying your not a Marine but i found two pretty obvious flaws in your comments. Me being a Marine from 1997-2003; #1 flaw we NEVER call ourselfs ex- Marines,never, #2 flaw you sd a “Buncha Marine doctors patched you up” I have never seen One much less a Buncha Marine doctors you should know the Navy handles that, just wondering I could be wrong
I think that after owning maybe 40 shotguns over the years and shooting for Federal and the Army I would rather buy American and keep the money here regardless of cost. I’ve had many Remingtons 31’s 32’s 870’s 1100’s and all are good to great guns . My favorites are my model 50 Winchesters . Having said that the Mossbergs are tough , economical and never fail and my choice for defensive purposes .
It’s the labor cost. R.I.P. Twinkies ! You want junk, the chinese will make it. You want a decent gun, the chinese will make it, too!
As a registered customer of CTD and a frequent purchaser of products through their web site, I am a bit surprised that this Log (or Blog) is not moderated. Some of the comments submitted above are totally off topic. Some might even be considered offensive to some people.
Now, I’m certainly no saint. But I’d suggest that we all keep the comments on-topic and not stoop to posting personal attacks.
One more thing: If CTD can’t do its part to help keep this Log “clean”, maybe it isn’t worth a following by their customers.
Can’t help but wonder, I know that at least one time that the Mossberg Maverick was made,purportedly, in Mexico, back in my gun shop manager days, and that at least the riot barrel replacements for the Remington 870’s were made by Mossberg. But, like the rumors of QC issues after Remington, Marlin and others were bought out, anything is possible. Things always change, like FN making a factory near Ft Jackson, SC, my family’s backwoods, nearly, because they had to to have the military contracts.
First off-@Kenn, comment #88-right on, brother! I have a particular love of the old Ithaca Riot Shotguns, and of all places, it has been along the used racks of local pawn shops that I have scored outrageous deals on an agency-modified Ithaca Stakeout, 7 shot extended 12 gauge pump with the Original Ithaca pistol grip-only model, and a patrol issue wooden stock Ithaca (4+1) 12 gauge riot gun. I wish the new Ithacas now made did NOT have the disconnector now added-being able to train for the rapid fire of holding the trigger as you pump and simultaneously fire s great! And great for training others. But, not wanting to wear down my collectors, I got the excellent Mossberg Special Purpose model 500,7+1,12 gauge pump that is also parkerized. Sucks in the Sentry Solutions Marine Tuf Glide, great for protection even for saltwater ops in service. The reviews seem favorable, mostly, although I DO prefer not to buy Chinese. It still might be an even better option for the teaching of others on a basic stock, riot style pump action. I teach both types. To be said for the used market, I have even scored an older Remington 1100 12 ga that was marked WAY LOW for the unevenly cut down barrel-to 22”. I had to but even the cut to a sweet 20”, hone the action and add on a pistol grip equipped full synthetic stock. So, there are options, but maybe I can fill in the Made In China with compounding,ha ha ha! I freely admit to having an excellent RPK (Romanian AES-10), Polish AKMS,an incomparable CZ 75D Compact 9mm (about 3,000 rds of 9mm JHP +P+ negates the caliber argument). the thing is, being a multi service vet in particular, I got the training along the way to pick up ANY weapon serviceable on the battlefield and use it. I honestly pine for my old M60 LMG, but the economics of the RPK suited my wallet best! (For heavy receiver units like this-cured in by heat bonding oils like Militec 1 ,for machine guns, cures them into perfectly operating machines! Even followed the tip to add it to my V Twin’s crankcase!) Don’t get me wrong,I loathe communism, and do not trust the Chinese, nor the new era Putin-ese!
But I have a retreat, for just in case, and bedsides already training people basic and advanced weapon tactics there, I have a small unit to help arm for survival training. Not a militant, not an anarchist, just a survivor who likes to train the Good Guys how to live and survive, and have a group that I am willing to take in in exchange for special skills for the better good of us all. Just call me a vet who wants to be left alone if the balloon drops. Now-I respect anyone’s beliefs as long as it doesn’t involve the harming of others or dogs! But I deserve the same. So please do not preach religion to me. Call me jaded, but my only source of strength is my family, pups and my skills to survive. If I pray to Odin and wish for Valhalla, it is my choice. Yes, yes, maybe I’ll go to hell, but I have already been there and back, and back, and back. Plus three bad marriages-so I figure I am owed some points in the game! It drove me nuts-short trip-to see if this Remington 870-based Hawk shotgun has the semi cut slot in the shell guide/follower, the way the 870’s are now for making it easy to clear a jam now. I have my old 870 done in the way we used to fix this, by drilling two larger holes and cutting a slot in the center. Saves your range time or even your bacon by allowing the back of a knife blade to push a shell back into the magazine tube-rather than the fun of stripping down the shotgun. Mine has a ten shot extension tube added on and braced, so I might as well drop it and draw my Para GI Expert .45 acp w/o the modification. Curious to know if 870 accessories and magazine tube extensions can be added onto the oriental special, ha ha! But seriously, I owe a LOT of my gear, ammo and emergency rations and expanded professional First Aid/First Responder gear to Cheaper Than Dirt for the great deals! (I do think THEY OWE Me a size XXL or XXXL company shirt and cap for the roughly $30,000 I have spent with them though, ha ha ha ha~!) One of the finest deals they have are the EXCELLENT Condor double rifle and discreetly shaped padded cases. They and the Molle long gun scabbards of nylon are great for the fair-sized collection of training weapons I have to protect. Great Work, CTD! now about that shirt…ha ha ha ha! Sin-cerely, Mike ”Cujo” Perrine
Sounds good to me. Those who want to throw away hard-earned dollars, may do so. However, Willard Mitt Romney and I see no reason not to invest in Chinese.
We are a peculiar nation we have been importing things from other nations for all time. Baretta, Browning, Springfield, Defend your self at all cost at any cost, no matter what it’s okay to wish and dream American but quite frankly quality is quality. And a dollar spent is a dollar spent. In America on Americans.
I am 77 and it is interesting but very sad to watch the demise of the worlds greatest nation. Guns won’t save us it will be when the moronic electorate finally realize they are about to lose it all. It will most likely be to late by then. We will only know when the end arrives. That end is not to far off. The only pleasant thought I have is that when the real shooting starts the welfare and anti gun people will be the first to meet Jesus.
The usual rantings of a bunch of beer swilling red neck southern good ole boy mall ninjas wanna be. Their iq is always lower the caliber of the guns they own.
ROFL, Chinese are communists. You guys are funny. A communist country were worker unions are outlawed unless they are sanctioned by the party and usually the company that employs them.
Hate to break it to you, but more like godless capitalists. Americans wonder why their salaries and benefits continue to crumble, yet they cut their own necks to save a few bucks on something that is going to last a lifetime anyway.
Rich people would sell their mother to make a buck, everyone else apparently would buy a mother made in China if it saved them a few bucks.
there is nothing about being close between communism and capitalism. communism is run by a collective, the elite. they decide what products will be made.
true capitalism is run by the buyers the people, the sellers try to keep up with the buyers and if the buyers don’t want something it is not made. the harder you work the more money you get. that is why we ended up the greatest nation. we work on supply and demand. the harder you work the more you get.. unfortunately our country is looking more and more like communism , there will be hell to pay when this government collapses because it can’t pay it’s bills. it is coming soon to a neighborhood near you. under communism people expect the government to take care of them and there is no sense in working very hard because you get paid the same.
the debt and the entitlements we owe will bring us down and obummer made sure it was coming soon by doubling the money supply and doubling the national debt. no one not even the US can live on debt. we are close to the collapse it is coming soon.perhaps after the collapse we can get back to people needing to work for what they get. we will all need a few good shotguns and ammo. as long as they are reliable. we need cheap guns because the middle class is being forced into poverty. things are getting ugly. i did not here what this gun cost but with a mossberg around $300 now hopefully it will be under $200.while i believe in buying american. some of us do not have money and need these cheap guns. the more guns there are the harder it will be for people running around trying to take things because they did not prepare. cheap reliable guns always have a place or should in our country. if we have to import them so be it..
The only qualm I have with this particular gun is that it is made by Norinco.
Like all Chinese gun & ammo manufacturers, the money your money goes straight to the Red Chinese Army, not a company first. Even in most East European & Russian Companies, the companies get the money at least.
I don’t see what the big deal is about the receiver being streek rather than aluminum, last time I checked steel is cheaper than aluminum.
CTD, please STOP PROMOTING THAT CHINESE CRAP. Even if it is almost as good as the Remington, I don’t care. I think it’s crazy for such a “pro-American” company like yourselves to be even selling this Chinese garbage. Guess you guys care about selling quantity rather than selling American made products. Stop giving China or money and jobs! Please. If you know what’s good for you, and our country, you will refuse to buy/sell Chinese made products. They can’t even make plastic products or dog/cat food without poisons or heavy metals.
STOP BUYING/SEEING CHINESE MADE PRODUCTS !!!!
Forget American made…… America is falling apart and when it does I just want weapons and ammo. It would really suck to spend 1000k on a gun and have no scope or ammo. Better yet you can spend the extra 90 and support our Socialist/Communist gov.
Wake up for what America is… a shit show. I’m in the military and I approve this message. America was fine well before the drafted the Bill of rights. And if you know your history Ben Franklin was working with the Brits http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmFPfEYRZF8&feature=related
Nice little video on your founding fathers who destroyed the free land.
I,ll just do what i did with my two ARs . And build my own . Then I know what I have .
Kenn hit the nail on the head with post #88, I’d rather spend $150-$175 on a older used Mossberg/Winchester/Remington at a local gun shop or show, that will go bang when I need it, than this POS that uses inferior materials from a country that places little value on human life, especially American, aside from the economic issues…If you’re worried a used shotgun will be “worn out”, think again, most will outlive you or your kids…
We all complane about no jobs and low income here in the US and yet we buy products made overseas. I don’t care if it cost more for the American made product, I always buy American. How could not? There are no excuses.
I’m all for supporting american companies. One of the american made guns that I have, is a Hi-point. Very inexpensive gun, works well, fairly accurate, and if it does happen to break the company will fix or replace it free. Thing is, some people act like I have the plague, just cause I actually like my Hi-point. Where are all the people that want to support american buisness when I’m at the range?
I will no longer support a people whom are predators and prey on the emotions of others saying support us.
It is the American way to drive a hard bargain and reward the individual that works hard, rather than having a hard ass union.
I don’t care what country you live in, if your product is better AND cheaper, you win! It’s the American way.
Those of you that believe in the “support America” ideology are welfare supporters. We need to get our asses together and begin to work harder for less and sacrifice our todays in order to protect our tomorrows.
The welfare state we have become is embarrassing, and yes I benefit from a Union that continually is shooting itself in the foot by making unreasonable demands of my employer and I may soon be out of work as a result.
These are tough times, you need to toughen up and quit relying on the sympathies of others. Get to work and quit whining like little girls. Begin to think about ways to improve your productivity rather than your bottom line.
Still using my Mossberg Defender, great pump action, loaded 1st two rounds with bird shot, don’t want to destroy the walls along with the bad guy, then the next three are number two buck. I used an old trench gun while walking point in Nam, wish I could find one I could afford.
Brownings were never made in the US but look how many are ownd and how many of us still want one.
This is piece of Chinese junk perpetuated on the American public. Just buy the original for not much more and stop financing our enemy. I will never own any “firearm” made in China. Just about everything they produce is crap and you get crap when you buy crap.
Where do you think all the junk you buy at Walmart comes from genius?
Regarding what started all this, ie: buying a low-cost shotgun, don’t they have gun shows where you folks live? Or are you too proud to buy a used weapon? I paid $100. for a beautiful 12 ga. Remington pump a few weeks ago. Near the closing time of the show and I’ve never been embarrassed to offer less than an asking price at gun shows and flea markets. No problems, looks very good if not brand-new, but just wanted home defense anyway. Yup, I’m on a budget. But have lots of stuff ’cause I seldom buy new.
I usually do not create many comments, but i did some searching
and wound up here Our Top Selling Gun. And I actually do have 2 questions
for you if it’s allright. Could it be simply me or does it look like some of these remarks come across like they are written by brain dead visitors? 😛 And, if you are posting on additional social sites, I would like to follow everything fresh you have to post. Would you list of all of all your community sites like your twitter feed, Facebook page or linkedin profile?
WHEN I SQUEEZE THE TRIGGER TO DEFEND MY FAMILY OR FRIENDS,I DO NOT WANT TO HEAR A CLICK OR RISK A CHANCE OF GETTING PART OF MY FACE BLOWN OFF BY A POOR QUALITY CHINESE SHOTGUN.I WENT TO MY LOCAL GUN SHOP AND THEY HAVE BOTH THE 982 AND THE MOSSBERG 500,THERE IS NO COMPARISION IN THE QUALITY ! SPEND THE EXTRA $$$ YOU NEED THESE THINGS TO WORK 100% OF THE TIME ! IT COULD BE THE DIFFERENCE IN LIFE OR DEATH !
The IAC Hawk makes a 500 look like a toy. I have both.
Bought one of the 982’s from CTD back in February of this year. Paid the $175, and change, as listed at that time. Had it at my FFL holder a couple of days later. Started modifying with 870 components: 6 rd saddle, 2 rd mag extension, teflon coated follower, collapsible stock and railed fore stock, red dot site, laser/light, etc… all designed for the 870. Ran a few hundred rounds through it and it goes bang every time. Love it, and I am happy with my purchase. Just like every other American, it all comes down to the pocket book. Nuff said!
#83, I am an Economist. When a Company purchases materials from which he will build his product, the provider of those materials bills the company right? The cost of extracting the materials etc. is BUILT into his bill to the company making the product. So you see the cost associated with obtaining & shipping the Raw Materials is “captured” in the books of our producing company & we haven’t missed it or misplaced it. BTW B/4 getting Dr. in Econ. my BA was in acctg.; so I’m actually both = Acct/Econ.
Enough of the $$ crap, I love the gun.
if you are an accountant that is a fine explanation, if you are an economist you would be remiss not to take into acct. the labor costs associated with the raw materials. they don’t arrive on the plants doorstep by serendipity.
Spend the extra $90 and spend American dollars in America. Get the Mossberg! Buy American. Fu#k the Communist.
#78, in the wildly exciting world of “Cost Accounting” Raw materials is one of the factors in calculating the cost of materials that went into producing each product. Labor and materials are ‘tracked seperately to enable management to accurately determine the cost of each. Only when you precisely identify, and account for, specific costs, can you focus on reducing those costs, and thus increase profitability of the product/company. Told ya this was exciting! (?)
Anyway, that’s why material costs are maintained seperate from labor costs, later they are combined ultimately resulting in a figure that represents the total cost of goods manufactured, then down once more to determine the actual costs of the products that were sold. Believeit or not this is an oversimplification. OH I have shivers!
Hobart Hill, I respect your comments. Likewise Retired 57th, who had a number of comments earlier. To be candid, this was the first internet discussion I had ever posted any comments on. The reason: I was astonished by the fervor unleashed by this simple topic. It became a political discussion, apparently, due to the inherent international economics, thus politics of the issue. It decided me to come forth with a few viewpoints of my own. I’m not a vet, but I have lived and worked in a few different places in the world. At this time, I’m pretty certain that the U.S. is the last dominoe in the way of global rule. So we’d better hold out.
Gentlemen;
Peace. The enemy is within. In-sourcing, out-sourcing, placing the blame – – – It started out evaluating a weapon and has ended up a political forum. So be it. I am 87, WWII Vet. In my day, growing `up’, we had legislators – patriotic, continuing the Constitution. Now, I’m going ‘down’ in a country I don’t know anymore because of politicians.
Worse – I am ‘seeing’ history repeat itself. In 1933 an unknown little man burst on the scene in Germany with ‘change’in his agenda and a book he had written outlining his plan for is new world. Four years ago an unknown burst on the scene in the United States with his plan for`change’ and a book he had written – – – and look what he has done to us. And now he wants our guns so he will be safe AND WE WON’T BE ABLE TO RESIST.
Whether the weapon was made in Italy or Brazil or China – what difference will it make when they come looking for them ? VOTE AGAINST THEM – LET’S BRING BACK THE CONSTITUTION BEFORE ‘CHANGE’ HAS WIPED IT OUT.
hugel
to no 76, possibly, so discounting the labor requirements of different industries, and sticking with the 30/35% fact, one would think that
no 76, possibly, hope your source took into acct. how much labor it took to get the raw or partially finished materials out of the ground and to the factory.
Wow! CTD shows us which gun is the best seller and suddenly the USA is being “Taken Over” by Communists! I’ve got some bad news for Y’all, China OWNS America Already. If the American Public didn’t own so many weapons and if We didn’t Buy so much of Chinas products, China would demand payment on the American Securities they hold and We would ALL become Chinese SUBJECTS. Our POTUS is determined to leave a legacy and since it’s Not going to be Universal Health Care He’s found a way to DIS-ARM Us all by way of an INTERNATIONAL GUN BAN through the United Nations.
You better stop worrying about where Folks buy their guns from and who is Holy or Heathen and start Praying that EVERYONE knows how to use those guns and just how to keep our own Uncle Sam from confiscating them all from us. We may be the Most Armed Nation in the World but that won’t mean anything to a Robotic Drone with two 2,000 pound bombs that’s been tasked to uncover Your stash of weapons. That’s Right! If the Commies don’t get us our Islamic POTUS will.
OUIT SWEATING THE SMALL STUFF!
rEPLY TO COMMENT # 73. jUST NEED TO POINT OUT THAT LABOR COST IS IN NO WAY 90% IN THE U.S. Industrial average is 30-35%. FACT!
What major US corporation has about 300,000 employees with about 140,000 overseas working in some 42 different countries ?
Here’s a hint, He is Obamas JOBS CZAR. That’s right Jeffrey Immelt.
Immelt also just moved GE’s ENTIRE X-ray division to China in a joint venture with the Chinese. GE has developed the most advanced technology in this area period. Now we share that tech with the Chinese.
BTW what did GE pay in taxes last year? They didn’t.
How was GE able to get away with all this? Let’s just say they got friends in high places.
Yet What is Obamas campaign theme ! INSOURCING. And yes, Immelt got the memo.
People are demanding to see Rormneys tax returns from the 1990’s. Maybe people should worry about their own 2013 tax returns when taxes go up about 20% in January. Well, 20% for those who actually pay federal taxes to begin with. 47% pay no fed taxes as you know.
How does the US compete overseas when more than half of its citizens collect some form of govt subsidy or assistance, when cities are declaring bankruptcy every week. Or when the president says all you business owners are successful because “someone” made it possible for you. Who Is that someone? The govt …..and obama wants bigger govt. how do you compete overseas when most major US industries are unionized, and foreign companies are not only NOT unionized, but often get govt assistance.
Sure we can increase tariffs on imports, and get more favorable trade agreements, but we will still continue down the same path with Greece and Spain. The US is becoming an entitlement state. Thank the crooked politicians.
There are far more workers than there are jobs in China. Most major factories in china provide dorms for its workers. They also provide stores, and dining halls. Any old timers recall the “company stores” back in the day ? Most chinese work 7 days a week, and happy to get it. A few months ago there were demonstrations when owners only talked about work week being cut from 7 days. Medical is free of course. And yes most big factories still run 24/7. How do you compete with china when the industrial base in the US has shut down and/or gone overseas.
Foreign companies actually have factories in this country making products for international sales. Should be US companies with US factories….
Yet Obama just gave millions to some Euro electric car maker. A car that doesn’t work.
The US politicians who take in Chinese campaign money hand over fist, tell us how evil the Chinese are. True but not entirely true. Chinese have a vested interest in ensuring our economy does well, (as does most of the thinking world). I think we borrow 34 cents out of every dollar from the Chinese. That debt will NEVER be paid off.
Why does china have us in this position? Crooked US politicians.
Yet folks get ticked off when others buy a cheap Chinese shotgun….
We are being played by the politicians.
I just went to the store today, and checked out the shotguns in question. I looked at the Chinese made shotguns for sale at $179.99, then I checked out the Remington 870 express for $347.99. While comparable in looks, I did notice a big difference in weight as the Remington weighed considerably less. The action was a lot better on the Remington, as well as trigger pull was considerably better on the Remington. Now I took all of the comments on this particular topic to the store with me, and ended up buying the Remington. Was it a felt loss in the pocket book? YES. However I am not willing to bet my life on some Chinese piece of crap wannabe shotgun. Will the Chinese shotgun go bang when you pull the trigger? Probably but who knows for how long. When the SHTF and the Chinese are over here which gun do you think they would prefer?
Labor is 90% of the cost of most manufactured goods (i’m guessing but probably not far off), United States cannot manufacture because of low labor rates in other countries, now that we are all living at reduced standard and the unions are out of favor, labor cost will go down. Labor prices in other countries are going up. We will again begin to manufacture in the United States. So just hang on we will all have low paying production line jobs soon. We will organize and begin getting a decent wage vis a vis products produced.The manufacturing will go back to Asia or Africa after their economy collapses again. Buy American or demand tarriffs from your representatives. Global corporations may be good for the world but they are not good for the United States, you decide. Vote republican again this year to protect your special interest. Be assured someone will get rich and give you a hearty thank you. buy an 870 pay what it’s worth or send your brother in laws job overseas.
The post commenting on most of Remington’s parts coming from China goes one and lists a number of reasons why he thinks we can’t compete with China, for example he listed such things as preferential treatment, taxes, tariffs, corrupt politicians, etc.
I do not question any of those, the BIGGEST reason we can’t compete is in China’s labor practices. Their labor cost is a mere fraction of ours! Now the are a number of reasons that it’s labor cost are dirt low. Sweat shops, etc., but when a union worker in the US is guaranteed $40 per Hour, and the Chinese worker is paid $2.98 per Day.
There is obviously a huge gap here. Let me give a quick example: Suppose XYZ Company produces and sells a product, assume he does not farm out to any other country any part of his product. Now when he analizes his production cost, he may find that 35% of his costs are in labor & related $$. He discovers he is losing $5 on each product he makes and he cannot raise his prices becauses thar will only increase his loss. The bean counters announce that if they have their product produced in another country at a significant reduction in cost & a big increase in profits. Remember he was losing money, by keeping production on-shore! He has investors that are going to take their investment $$ elsewhere, if he can’t produce profitable return on their investment. He now has 2 choices 1)go out of business or 2)have his product made offshore.
Now don’t shoot me, I’m just the messinger!!!! I don’t have to like it, but I do have to understand it, if I am going to find a cure. The cure gets more difficult as soon as you inject corruption/politicians.
The post expressing suprise at buying a Mossberg, only to find that the barrel was made in China. During my life (I R old) I managed to pick up a couple of doctorate degrees, one is in economics. Now that’s supposed ta mean dat I r a jeanius at eberyting lated to economicalism stuff rite? Now Serious, the doctorate is real and I have been writing and/or telling my students and other economists (since 1971) that this country’s biggest threat did not come from the then USSR. The biggest military AND economic threats to this nation(soon to lose its’ status as a Soverign Nation) comes from CHINA. It isn’t funny, but we actually gave them the economic tools to bury our economy. What is CHINA’s biggest problem? ‘Population per square yard’! They are out of room, and their population just keeps growing.
Oh sure, the rate of population growth bounces up and down; but it keeps growing. What is China’s next biggest problem? How do you feed all those folks.
When any nation faces those two problems; what are it’s options? Think about! I’ll give you a hint. Mass suicide ISN’T being considered! All of you are bright enough to figure it out!
Just about everything Remington makes, incl most gun parts, are made in China. Everything from knives to thermos bottles to coolers. As long as a comparable item that is made in the US is available, so there is a choice, I have no problem.
However, these crooked politicians are slowly ensuring there is no choice. Preference is typically given to Chinese products. Go to high end stores, and you’ll see off shore items, often Chinese. US companies can easily produce these items but often cannot do it at a better price. They cannot compete.
Why?
Crooked politicians have placed too many reqmts, taxes, fees, etc on US business. while foreign manuf have it much easier. They can survive on less profit. They don’t have unions and often they are subsidized by their govt.
When we export we pay thru the nose for tariffs and taxes and are subject to quotas, by these same govts.
The trade deficit is killing us, and it is the politicians responsible for that, not the consumer.
Gator, I have had a class 2 and class 3 FFL for over 25 yrs now. Years ago, some 2000 SKS carbines made in China to accept standard AK mags and drums were imported into the US. I still have one left. Over 1500 rds, and not one FTF. It is robust, cycles well, and despite very short sight radius (16 inch bbl), surprisingly accurate. It is well made and very light weight. It accepts every AK mag and drum we have, except of course the BATF California short mags. Receiver is machined out of soild bar stock. I also have a 1949 bring back, pristine SKS manuf at the Tusla factory in Russia. Many say, Tusla makes the best firearms in Russia. On every level, the Tusla out scores the Chinese SKS to some degree. I have a Star pistol, stout 7.62×25 tokarev, excellent condition, cycles very well, solid, well made, accurate, never a single FTF in over 1000 rds. I would not compare a Colt in say a .38 super with this Star. The one area I cannot evaluate is metallurgy without destructive testing. So for a long term / survival weapon, I would do as most and rely on track record and history.
People complaining about the gun being made in china probably drive foreign cars and have houses filled with products made in china, taiwan, mexico, korea, etc.
Mmm mosburg you say? Must be a knockoff because if you just read the barrel and would have seen its mossberg not mosburg.
I bought a Mosburg slug barrel for my 500.What do you know Mosburg name and all but on the back side (hard to find)it said MADE IN CHINA what do you know.You can not get away from it!!!!!
Hey mike, post 15…you put gas in your car, don’t you?
Retired 75th, I am totally tracking with you. Although a lot of the back and forth in this discussion has involved relative strengths of shotgun components, we all have deeper concerns due to our understanding of the REAL state of the nation. Survival of this country as a national entity is important, not only to us but the rest of the world. I have lived in several places in the English speaking world, and nowhere else have I seen the Constitution of the country actually used as basis for judicial and legislative argument. You have that here. Elsewhere I have seen individual rights to bear arms squashed (only the nanny state has the right to kill you). Wherever you hear “Global” – read International Players disrupting sovereignty of nations and individuals to their own secret ends. Getting back to the original topic: I own S&Ws; Glocks; Charter Arms; Remingtons; Marlins; Keltecs; Stag Arms; Rock River Arms; Springfields; Lee-Enfields and a Mauser. I don’t keep anything that doesn’t show the necessary qualities. If it were what was to hand, I’d use the Chinese shotgun. I didn’t because the others got into my hands first. Maybe because they didn’t have to come from so far away.
Yrs, Gator
By the end of WWII we were a world power. The only true world power. No one could come close to our manuf capacity or wealth.
Also 2/3 of the industrialized world was decimated or heavily damaged during the war. But We were isolated or protected by two big oceans, so no warfare within the US.
We are no longer isolated now. We are no longer a leader in industry because we no longer produce, we import as Gator has said.
Much worse, we are becoming a dependent welfare state. When half work and the other half live off those workers, and when there is no competition in healthcare, and the govt regulates what you eat and do, life will look like a scene out of the movie 1984.
And the future? Most high school kids can’t manage a checking acct, or figure out mortgage payments etc. let’s face it, most can’t find their butt with both hands a flashlight.
All the while we are played by the political class, who are played by the real power. The politicians create all these distractions to keep OUR eye off the ball.
We are right behind Greece and Spain, and most don’t see it. More and more major cities going bankrupt.
But before they can come knocking down your door, they have to disarm you.
Been interesting, out here.
We used to be the major manufacturer of electrical distribution components, relays, transformers etc. WE WERE THE WORLD STANDARD.
For about 25 to 30 yrs, we slowly pulled back, and today we no longer manuf these components. Almost all are imported.
I mention this because of the threat we all have been hearing about for years now from severe mass coronal ejections, sun flares, that could fry our electrical distribution. 2012 these flares are expected to peak.
We have also been told about the threat of an EMP weapon which could do the same. A freighter just off the US coast could fire a missile over the US and detonate at higher altitude, and no power for possibly a year or more.
Why? Transformers will be fried. Since we no longer manuf them, we have to import them. How long would it take to get them? Say, 10,000 of them?
Course when everything that runs off a processor could also be fried, I guess, no lights would be no big deal. Course, no lights mean no power, no sewage treatment, no water treatment, and on and on. 99% of all homes would be ordinarily condemned under that scenario. Course no place for anyone go, so it wouldn’t matter.
What are the politicians doing about it? The ones trying to grab our guns., Too busy trying to keep their jobs., to do their job.
Having read all the above posts, I am impressed by the heat of the arguments. A while ago I looked into the timeline of the “Buy American” campaign promoted by Sam Walton. It appears to me that his overtures that led to firmly establishing Walmart Chinese buying were ocurring AT THE SAME TIME. This is an example of a PR practice – TELL A BIG ENOUGH LIE. They weren’t the only ones going over to the Chinese, but were ahead of the game and became very successful at it.
There has been a snowball effect in outsourcing production, leading to our being a nation of consumers rather than producers. But beware – history tells us this is a serious strategic error. America became a world power as a PRODUCER. From the start, in order to survive, it had to produce more and more of its own essentials to replace imports. Once again, looking at historical examples – a first line of war upon a country is blockade. Deny trade, sink the ships of supply. Sound familiar? Well, we lay ourselves open to this by getting more and more of our essential goods from foreign and hostile powers. We are being sold downriver by our heads of commerce and our administrators. Such connivance, in an earlier day, would have been correctly termed “Treason”. Now we hear some say “It’s all good”. This is a declaration of apathy. If we are to survive, we had better get back to “PRODUCE AMERICAN”. People here and abroad WILL “Buy American”, if it is a good product. That counts for not only our material goods, but our culture and foreign policy, too.
Yrs, Gator
Unpatriotic? Unamerican?
Why do we import so many goods once made here in the US?
The politicians. They make laws, establish taxes, fees, and set tariffs on foreign goods imported into the US. Politicians are responsible for the trade deficit, not us.
US Business often can’t compete with imports because of the reqmts, laws, fees, etc imposed by the US govt on them. How does a US company compete with a $2 shirt made in Bangladesh? They can’t. But the politicians can set a tariff on those goods.
How do you think Japan built an auto empire here ? Low import tariffs. Also the japanese sold their cars at a loss initially to lock up the market. Those imports were the better cars initially, better mileage as well, but US companies caught up after a time.
When Americans finally caught on, foreign auto makers started building foreign cars here to curb the anger.
On the other hand the reqmts, tariffs and fees the US (politicians) Impose are insignificant compared to the reqmts and tariffs imposed on US exports by foreign countries.
US govt is often more business friendly to foreign companies/countries than they are to US companies.
One exception. Foreign made cars now have a modestly high tariff (import tax) because of the AFL CIO – the unions. The unions have a lot of influence in DC, so the US auto industry is more protected now than any other US industry.
Right now we are getting ready to sign a treaty with the UN which will impact what firearms we can buy and own. Now you can laugh about that, but this admin is 100% behind it.
Someone mentioned Gock, versus the beretta. During the military trials, Glock was not selected for testing. In fact glock was not able, or chose not to, provide the required 35 models for testing. You might recall, glock was focussed on the 17 about than. Also did not have the rep.
Re Sig. Even though Sig has plenty of GSA contracts, they were higher cost than the beretta.
Icarried a 1911 and 1991 for a few decades, so I don’t care much for double action, and especially decockers. . I don’t have a problem with Beretta, but I do with the sub caliber, 9mm. That was a serious mistake. A much better high tech choice would be a 5.7..
Along the same lines, 5.56 is barely adequate in the jungle, in heavy brush, but not adequate in built up areas, where you go from door kicking to rooftops and 200 and 300 yd shots. You need a battle rifle for those shots. But than a carbine is easier to get in and out vehicles/loach. . So thats one trade off. Just my opinion.
Btw anyone know where the beretta factory is ? Maryland. Who are the big wig political hacks there.
Not to turn this into a political discussion as some have done, but,
One other comment re china being our ally. Prior to Chiang Kai chek being forced out of china by Mao and the communists, Mao came to the US to ask for economic help. The US sent him packing.
Chek went to Formosa, later to be renamed Taiwan. Later Pres Reagan abandoned Taiwan.
Not only did we ignore Mao, but Ho Chi Minh came to the US after WWII for the same reason, economic aid. Anyone remember Vietnam? Some of us old timers spent some there.
So who helped them out ?
The USSR did. Well. The USSR doesn’t exist anymore, even though the old KGB still runs Russia.
US is on the ball alright…..
I am retired military and retired fed, and now having to work part time. I think most here don’t have a clue. The political class are playing us like puppets. How did the Japanese, the country we rebuilt after WWII get such a foothold in the US beginning in the 1960’s? How did the Koreans get such a foothold in the US after we rebuilt their country after the Korean War? How did the Chinese get the largest foothold in the US beginning with Nixon opening the door to the Forbidden Kingdom ? That’s right, the politicians, lawmakers, and administrations opened the door. Remember when Walmart had signs all over saying, Made in the US? Trust me there was that time. Now almost everything is made overseas, most in China. The politicians got their thieving hands out to anyone with the bucks, no matter who. China is protected by the politicians by them buying our debt. The Chinese now want to protect their investment, and they do so buy selling so many goods here. And the crooked, lying, backstabbing, traitorous politicians work for their best interests. Don’t attack the poor guy needing a weapon on a small budget for buying Chinese. Heck, the US Olympic team is wearing uniforms made in china. Anyone remember Clinton making that deal with the Chinese so a Chinese company would be making all US military uniforms? Almost got away with it, but some newbie politician repub busted him. Does anyone know what made in the us means, per our worthless politicians? 51% of materials manuf in the US minimum, but their are exceptions. Oh yeah. All raw Materials may be obtained overseas. These materials than made into something in the US. FOR EXAMPLE, Overseas Cotten made into cloth in the US, and the cloth made into shirts overseas. Consumers did not do this, the crooked politicians did it. They sold out this country. Check it put. Anybody in the US make military grade 3.7 volt batteries/chargers. A GSA contract got them for us from an overseas vendor. Anyone remember those semi-auto M14’s made in China? How many US made civilians got torn up by these rifles? Anybody get a dog or cat poisoned by made in china pet foods a few years ago? How many lap tops from Los Alamos ended up in china during the Clinton admin. oh yeah, these crooked politicians take good care of the Chinese economy. One last thing. The single largest group of foreign property buyers/investors in the US, after Americans of course, is……….the Chinese. Lots of millionaires in china these days.
You who complain about Chinese guns yet purchase tools, clothes, housewares, etc., etc., etc., made in China.
Stopping being a sheep led around by the media, democrats or republicans. Do something original and try thinking for yourself.
How many wars has USA had with China? Yes, laws in China stiff. Our jury system is a joke. DWI or DUI in china? 5 years no driving. If caught driving, hard time. Sell drugs? death. I like it. Safe country. Also things do not like. But it is not safe to walk alone and unarmed in South Phoenix once sun goes down. In China, walk anywhere, anytime, any how….They do some things very nicely.
How about Germany, Japan? Viet Nam?….China would be an ally if USA politicians didn’t have hands in so many other countries and corps.
I will take an AK47 from China anytime, anywhere, any day. PS: they are now using bullpups in their military.
Think about this…the #1 selling handgun on the planet ( this includes America) is the Glock. Is it made in America? Nope. Is it purchase & used by 65% of the US police forces? Yep. So does that make the majority of America police forces un-America, or just smart for purchasing reliable quality product? Marinate on that.
While I also buy American whenever possible I think its pretty silly to use that as a main argument against buying one of these shotguns, considering the performance and value. I see so many people inflate themselves with pride on the belief that they are ‘real’ americans due to buying Americun, riding harleys (know where many of their parts are made?…) and other similar things. Brace yourself for this shocking news, purchasing American made items isnt a primary definer for being a patriot. Ive encountered many folks that run this act who would be the last ones you’d want to be covering your six. There are also plenty that use whatever they can get their hands on that I’d be happy to have on my side. Nuff sed.
Home defense? My Glock 21 is perfect in that respect. You just gotta be able to hit what you’re shootin’ at. Nothing like looking down the barrel of a bulldog of a gun! And I do have an 870. Also don’t like to buy Chinese. Hard not to these days, but still trying.
Magnum6
And those supporting him
Ex-Marine?
The only ex-Marines I ever served with……..well,there aren’t any.
Dead or discharged,they’re all still Marines.
I feel like I need body armor in here! I can’t let a couple of comments pass without correction. Magnum6, you refer to Marine “doctors and medics”. The USMC has neither! Doctors used by the Marines are Navy! The medics attending to Marines are Navy Hospital Corpsmen. I am sensitive to this, after a year in Great Lakes Naval Hospital.
I have quite a few foriegn made weapons, my favorites being the SAIGA’s, (762, 308) They are the baddest AK platforms I have ever owned/fired. I sold all of my other AK’s, just to get more SAIGA’s. They rock. Knock us all day long. I buy American all day long. Ruger and Mossberg being some of my faves. Niether make SAIGA’s. Sooo…..I buy what I like. Period. I am as American as it get’s, so that make’s me an enemy of the current communist regime. And that’s fine with me. HOG
Hey folks, THE BOTTOM LINE, Environmental Regulations, Worker Pay, Worker Benefits, Tax System, Quality of Materials, are in no way similar to US standards. A Chinese manufacturing plant would never be able to operate in the US, they’d never be able to meet the regulatory standards. FAIR TRADE ask yourself how is it fair they can destroy their environment and workers.
Wah, it’s ‘Chinese’. Yeah, disappointing it’s not US made, but budgets and price tags are a serious factor, considering the market for self defense generated under our current number one all time firearms salesman, 0bama. Be real people, how many average Joes can actually afford the $2000 for the above AR-15 rig? Maybe they’re saving their pocket change towards one. Good plan, unless the SHTF next weekend. Now what, 2/3 the way there, and now no hardware for defending the house? So for about 1/10th the price tag, Joe can now have a chance against the mobs. Or for the same cash outlay, an apparently fair gun and 1500 rounds of 00 buckshot.
“Something is better than nothing” Massad Ayoob, renowned firearms instructor. You can kill a bad guy with a $100 used revolver or a $1000 fancy toy. Which one is he more dead with?
Surviving urban crisis
There are other options if you want cheap, reliable, and made in the good ol usa, get a mossberg maverick 88. An excellent shotgun, most of the after market parts for the 500 fit on it excluding the forend and hovering right at $200 is still in the bottom dollar region. the maverick also comes with either an 18″ or 28″ barrel sadly no ghost rings but with the 28″ barrel i can still get 1″ grouping with slugs at 100 yards.
This Hawk is as good as an 870 in just about every regard except one major one, he forearm ring separates from the action bar if you jack it firmly. This won’t happen on others because one piece or silver solder is used by other manufactures. However, he Chinese have chosen to braze the two pieces, the action bar and forearm ring together. Once it gives, the gun becomes immediately inopperable. This is a fatal quality flaw. I had my welded back by a gunsmith, but sold it at a loss due to the lack of trust I had in the gun after that. Buyer beware.
The point here is just a review of a product, and simply put it the firearm that was being used function just as it said it would and is being sold at an amazing price. Yes it is made in China, if you dont want to buy a Chinese firearm then dont do it, however for those of us who need armaments and are on a tight budget then Chinese stuff is usually except-able. Personally I prefer to buy American but I dont always have the choice, being product availability or price.
I have a stevens 350 security, its the shorter the ghost rings sights and I prefer the ergo’s on it over my friends similarly configured 870. And according to what I can find is that the 350 is Chinese made. So even if they are made in china if the product is good it doesn’t matter where it comes from, How about an original Russian Ak-47 weren’t those made in a communist state and dont they have the reputation of being the most reliable and toughest weapon on the planet.
The thing that matters is that these weapons are in the hands of the American people, The only country with the right to bear arms and raise them against any enemy foreign and domestic. who cares who has the money when the shit hits the fan its who has the guns and bullets that matters, because as we have seen in the stock market money can disappear, hell think about how you spend and receive half of your money any more its virtual it doesn’t actually exist its all numbers in a computer. Now I’m patriotic and am all for supporting our folks at home but if they cant compete with foreign prices even after all the import taxes, then its not our fault its the companies. But there is another side of the coin because the American makers are strangled by government regulation, the EPA says what materials they can and cannot use, The companies have to have lawyers to handle suits when someone uses one of their weapons to defend themselves and shoots someone, They have to have HUGE insurance policies to cover the suits and any injury that may befall a worker.
So simply if you can buy American please do, so that companies may continue to survive the onslaught from anti-gun radicals and government over stepping its bounds, But if you can’t, purchase all the Chinese guns you can so that you may raise them to fight for your rights against all who stand against you. Remember Bullets n Beans.
You kidding me, stop buying communist garbage. The Mossberg 500 is everything you need. It is the only pump action shotgun to pass ALL of the military trials it went through.
I’ve used the Remington 870 in combat; defended my life & others with it. Those that received its wrath are no longer in this world. I don’t trust ANY weapon without running it through the wringer. I don’t trust the Chinese with business deals, nor will I ever trust or skimp on defending lives with Chi-Com crap. A neighbor has one of these Hawk 982s….want to see how it fares? Take it to a skeet range & blast at birds all day; you’ll see…
Sorry but I have to say “buy USA” and if on a budget go Mossberg 500. It has done the job for many many years and is as dependable as you can get.
I’m still holding out until I can get my hands on a Kel-Tek KSG!
Supporting American companies is great but supporting ’em when they aren’t being competitive is just ridiculous and frankly anti-American – we’re supposed to believe in free market principles. If our industries are being hamstrung by regulations or other issues, vote out the folks who’re slapping them on.
If I remember correctly, Remington’s cheap version of their 870 is made with aluminum – so this 982 is better in just about every respect, which is frankly unacceptable. We should demand more of our gun producers.
Also, I find the whole “wahhh, you’re supporting the Commies” argument laughable – I’ll bet almost to a man everybody making it owns a Glock or some other foreign gun. I’m more than happy to buy American when the price/quality is right but if we don’t have the best product then I’ll be going elsewhere, as should everybody else. Look up the Indian car industry to see the pitfalls of blindly supporting local industries.
Why should we by from American manufactures? What do they do to keep prices competitive? Nothing at all, out country is going to hell and out politicians are setting back filling their pockets with our money. So I do not feel bad at all buying guns or any thing from other countries. IF our country wants to turn things around they need to stop sending aid to all these counties about the world and look here at home, plenty of children starving here and we just sweep it in under the rug
I bought the NEF (New England Firearms) Pardner Pump 12 gauge version of this shotgun. It is also stamped “Hawk Industries” on the receiver and is (unfortunately) made in China. HOWEVER, NEF along with Marlin and H&R (Harrington & Richardson) is now owned by Remington and Remington warranties cover all of these brands. I had to send my Pardner Pump back to the Remington factory in Ilion, NY when the left feed latch fell out of the receiver. Remington restaked the left and right feed latch at no charge and shipped it back within 2 weeks. Remington also paid for shipping to and from the factory. I actually did not know before I bought the gun that it was made in China, but I am happy with my purchase. It’s just sad that Remington is outsourcing to a communist country.
My home defense shotgun is a Maverick 88 with an 18 inch Mossburg barrel. If I’m not mistaken Maverick is made in Texas by Mossburg and has a legitimate warranty etc. I like 870’s, and would certainly consider a 982 if I needed another one… but to say there are no american made alternatives is ridiculous. Mine cost $169 at a local Academy outdoor store 2 years ago. I can’t imagine they’ve gone up that much.
BS. I had one and it sucked. Misfired all the time. Think there was too much headspace or oversized chamber. The barrel was loose in the recieve even with barrel nut tight. The sight was crooked and the stock was cheaper plastic than even the remington plastic. like the other guy said, get a remington express model for $100 more. BTw I’ve had lots or norinco 45’s, ak-47, SKS’s and one of their uzi’s. Those all worked fine and shot pretty well compared to their copies.
I think the main part missed were the words, “on a budget”. I just purchased IAC 982 Hawk at Academy Sporting Goods for $199.00. The closest thing ‘American’ made was approximately $100-$150 more.(Same basic configuration, but without the ghost-ring sight.) I would have prefered an American made product, but I’m on a ‘budget’. If I had the extra money laying around I would have purchased an American made model. The gun functions great, by-the-way. Speaking of ‘American’ made, you might want to check ALL the parts on your guns.(AND check ALL of your material possessions at home for American made, don’t just pick on firearms.If you want to pick then make sure ALL your stuff is red, white and blue) Parts can be made elsewhere then assembled in the States and the final product be called “American made” It’s in some of the trade and manufacturing laws. I do agree, though, that ‘money’ has alot to do with it all, but…the prices of American made products(guns in this instance) have shot (no pun intended) through the roof. It’s all about greed. Anyway, I purchased what I could afford at the time.
WORD TO THE WISE:
DO NOT think that Chinese/Foreign/Import steel is the same as Domestic!
As a petroleum engineer I unfortunately have first-hand knowledge of how drastically different they are!
Chinese steel is not as pure as American, as it is not held to the manufacturing/quality control standards as that in the US is.
Case in point: Took over operations for a company that drilled a bunch of wells 3 years ago and equipped them entirely with Chinese steel products – the Casing, the tubing, the rod string, the pumping units.
In all of THREE YEARS, half the pumping units are broken, and in places I’ve never seen break before (and no, they were not overloaded according to American Petroluem Institute standards), several of the wells have casing leaks, several of the tubing and rod strings are practically junk.
All engineering practices and maintenance check out, which leaves what? The steel itself.
Steel that isn’t manufactured and submitted to quality control tends to have much lower stress tolerances. The tubing and casing then has much lower collapse and burst ratings.
Now, you can consider the barrel of a gun very similar to casing or tubing.
Ask yourself if you’d like foreign or domestic “tubing” keeping back the explosive force and pressure of a shotgun round that is mounted near your face?
I know which one I’d choose…
Be safe!
The issue is not American or Chinese sympathy as anyoneknows American worker off load the ships coming in and Americans work in theimport industry, trucking etc so allot of Americans jobs depend on this and other imports. The average American is not a middle class person actually most fall within the lower socieconomic stratification position so $175 is allot to them and the extra 90 bucks is the difference of milk on the table for their kids. I have no problem getting reloading supplies in large or small bulk nor inexpesive plinking ammo at walmart and the U.N has no power over our guns they can’t even protect their own in any third world countries crappy conflict. I am in the military and I am not even close to middle class and this gun looks good for the kids also I agree used guns are a good especially if its with out records just a straight legal buy between two people like we can do in Texas legally as long as the got a current driver liccense and seem to be lawfull it good…
@magnum6: Those pukes don’t deserve an explanation from you, they have no honor and no code in which they live by. Although they may be dangerous at times inevitably they will self destroy, and hopefully not take any innocent people with them.
I see comments on buy America or not buying American. Italy has made some great shot guns for years as well as other guns. My opinion is first look at the used gun market. There are some great guns with great savings right there. Also, don’t be so concerned about which gun or where it’s amde be more concerned about getting ammo for the guns. There are evil people buying ammo just to cause a shortage for us. Ask o’bama’s justice dept about the 600million 40SW bullet order. Getting supplies to reload are getting harder to find also. If you don’t have 10 thousand rounds of assorted ammo for 5 different kinds of guns you need more ammo. .22 ammo, .22 Mag, 40SW, .380, all shot gun, 9mm, 30-30, .306, .308, 5.56, 7.62X39, all and more are going to disappear soon. Between other governments, our government and us “sportsmen” ther just won’t be anough to go around. Be more concerned about the Hillery/UN treaty also. The end of life as we know it is over. The fll of the US is no different than the Romans, Greeks, Meds, Persians, Egyptians, and all other empire. Bottom line just buy what you can afford and like to shoot. Some guns are too complicated for many citiczens to break down and maintain. I love Glocks and new Rugers for theor simplicity. There is only about 7 parts to a AK and SKS so that’s easy for most folks to maintain. Keep it simple.
Magnum6, I have been sitting here this morning reading the comments on the shotgun, ETC…. Now as for respect. If one knows nothing of your service, awards, tours, etc.; that person owes you no more respect than the basic human respect he owes to others.
Now you and I are Bros (SF). If you base a degree of how much you respect a man of our generation on his military record, then you have no special respect for me; and I don’t demand it.
If I xeroxed a copy of my DD-214, I would have earned your respect, but for things I did before I was 21. In the meantime, I could have become a serial killer; unworthy of any respect! Semper Fi, my friend!
Well you go ahead and clown around all ya want . You have the right , but like I told David” , that might just come and bite you in the Yeg~Yang one day if ya do that out in the public like ya do on this computer. And by the way , I do like the Shotgun . I think it well Built , Esp: the Steel Reciver instead of Alum . As far as the holes in my chest and my legs , they`ve long been fixed” thank`s to a BUNCHA Marine” Doctors and Several Surgreys later . Yeah friend , I was a hurtin Unit” , MIGHTY Bad” that day until the Medic`s got to me and Knocked me plum out” , and they transfered me outa there . I woke up a month later IN a hospital , with my Sargent” and several others standing there looking me Stright” in my eyes and said” Your Still Here Marine” , I Told You Once” , You Are Not” Aloud To Die” , Without Permision ! …. It`s a Marine code of honnor thing , I do not think you would know anything about ….. He reached down , squeezed my hand , winked at me , said ” I`ll see you later and left . Spent several more weeks there in Therapy after they patched me up , Went Back” to my unit and finnished up the 3rd tour . So go ahead and poke More fun if that seen to be what you David get off on , you seem to read as you say , cat-like typing just fine , as well as David” does , but have your fun boys , Have Your Twisted Fun .
I got you’re back magnum6
“I didn`t say anything bad or good about the shotgun , and I DIDN~T Go Waaay off the Subject!”
Yeah, by your own admission here, you did.
You didn’t talk about the shotgun’s merits or detriments but posted an entire paragraph that’s barely legible unless someone knows how to read cat-like typing.
That’s pretty much “Waaay off the Subject!” there chief.
If you have sixteen bullet holes in your chest and three in your leg I highly suggest you sign off the computer and go to a hospital, that’s probably gotta hurt something awful.
I’m still trying to figure out how you got the tilde key (~) in “DIDN~T” since the N and T keys are nowhere near it.
David” Your little un~called for cattie comment`s are really starting to fire me UP” . I didn`t say anything bad or good about the shotgun , and I DIDN~T Go Waaay off the Subject! I was commenting on CTD misleading people on the there Web Page about the subject , in a round about way they were doing just like G-ManX was talking about , and You” want be a Jurk” and tell me I can`t spell , and Keep Quite” . Seem`s to me YOU” And DarkS7ar” read my spelling just fine! And I think you what I said comprehend just fine too , but for some reason you wanta smart off about it. What give`s You” the right , to tell Me” to Keep Quiet and Listen ? Maybe Your” one of them , what I call” Sunday Moring Christians that think you can just do as you please and everybody better stay outa your Way” Well let me tell you someting Ole Buddy ” , As a born US American” , and An Ex~US Marine” that`s More Than DONE” my time and More that paid my dues , I Have the FULL ” Right ” As A US Citizen” to Speak My Mind ” Sound`s like you might need to do a little more listening and a little less rambling your self. That might getchu in more trouble sometime than you wanta deal with lippin off to people like you do . And that go`s for you too , DarkS7ar” I`ve got 16 bullet holes in my chest” and 3 in my legs ! Untill you`ve walked where I`ve Walked” , You Boys” , don`t have the Right” to lip off to me , Or About Me. Now” That said, if yall want comm yourself`s down and be a little more respectful to other`s on here , I can do that Too”.
I buy American….. With that being said, will you ask the person that shot you if his gun was made in America or not? My guess is probably not. Will the coroner say yep looks like the guy was killed with another one of those Chinese made guns… My point is when you buy a gun for self defense that is the gun that you will use no matter what any body else says it all boils down to who is faster and has the best aim PERIOD
David I agree with you to an extent, that it may not be intentional and instead may just be a design flaw. However, CTD marketing reps are not stupid. They study their competitor’s sites and are fully aware of the different practices. Most other sites leave the previously offered lowest prices up rather than inserting another vendor in its place. It is my professional opinion that CTD is very aware of the differences and therefore should be considered deceptive. Each person’s perception is their own reality. If my reality finds this practice distasteful enough, I may take my business elsewhere. One could say “see ya and good riddance”, or they could take note and make changes. Yeah maybe it was only “$20 bucks” difference (as CTD Rob puts it), but when I have thousands to spend on rifles and ammo each year to run a rifle camp, it does hurt CTD’s bottom line as well as other consumers such as you if prices go up when people like me “beat feet” elsewhere. Simply put, life on the Web is already convoluted enough. With so much of our time already spent conducting Internet Commerce, companies need to do better. The last thing we need is to wade through CTD’s “wonky” site.
I think Magnum6 either has some really fat fingers or he just kinda rolled his face over the enter key at the end of every line.
Magnum6 this was a post about an AWESOME shotgun and you went waaay off the subject. It has nothing to do with your religious views. If you can’t bring anything relevant to a conversation, just keep quiet and listen. Learn to spell and people will have an easier time trying to comprehend your ramblings.
G-ManX the website is a little wonky, but they usually have links underneath the description of the same item from different warehouses with different prices. I’m not a fan of this or the way you have to go to different pages to see different offerings of the same item or to see reviews, but I don’t think they are trying to be deceptive.
Back at~cha David. Comprehension of what is going on around us all , is sometimes a hard thing for some to understand. That`s ok , it just take some folks a little longer to comprehend a full picture of something , that`s all. I understand if you can`t understand the meaning of some wording here . You might figuer it out later on down the road . And no , I`m not , as you call it, a crazy homeless person. If I were one of those people , I more than likely would`nt have this computer I`m typing right now , wouldn`t you say ? But I do fully comprehend very well” , what`s going on all around us all here in America my Friend.
Hey David (Post #16), what are you talking about? Judy Glovier (Post#11) did not call me out on anything. What both of you fail to realize is that due to my postings, CTD has since changed the link to a different page with a different distributor from that which was originally linked in the picture. The information I stated in my post #7 was accurate at the time of posting. The proof is that if you click the picture link in the article right now, it will take you to a different Item #: 2-IAC982 which is not the item originally linked to when I made my post. The item originally linked to by the author on day-one was actually Item #: 91401 (text link still goes to that one). As a web applications programmer, I was able to detect what most others could not. Please bear with me here because this next part gets complicated. What I attempted to express in my post (#7) was that nowhere on the original linked page or the new page would a consumer ever know that the gun could have cost only $177.08. The reason is because the site is designed so that pages with “Out Of Stock ” items remove original pricing completely and replace it with any available alternative distributor’s price. It is even designed to display the new price in line with the picture of the original item. One could view that as deceptive because you would never have known there is an offering for less. So my point is, if one never gets to see the original LOWER price of $177.08, how or why would you even want to request to be notified when it comes back in stock? As for there being a request link, that was modified as well.
Buy it when you can, for who knows what the “regime” has in mind~~~
Home Defense? Got it… In the form of a Smith & Wesson Model 3000 Riot Gun. A shortened barrel version of the 870 with a pistol-grip and flat black finish. Not a lot of kick, even with 00 Buckshot or slugs. I’ve put hundreds of rounds through it in the last couple of decades and love it. Mine came second-hand from the PA Dept of Corrections, $300 in 1988.
Magnum6 – WTF are you even talking about? You sound like a crazy homeless person.
G-ManX – I totally agree with your first comment (#5),but Judy Glovier called you out on your second one (#7). The web site isn’t perfect, but it’s not hard to navigate for anyone with minimal computer experience.
I bought one of these 982’s and I completely agree with Alec: F&F is excellent. It has a solid STEEL receiver; the action was a little rough at first, but after cycling it a few times, it is super smooth. The ghost ring sights are right on at 25 yards. Everything besides the barrel is interchangeable with 870 parts.
I have a Mossberg 535 with a 28″ barrel that I was trying to find an 18″ barrel for. Mossberg does not make an 18″ barrel for the 535 but they do have a 22″ (20″ with an extended choke?) barrel for around the same price as this gun. So instead of paying anywhere from $175 – $200 for a barrel and having to cut it down, I got this 982 for the same price, no cutting and it has ghost ring sights. How can you argue with that?
Sorry, but I’m not putting any more money into the hands of the communists. It’s bad enough that my computer and my cell phone are largely made with Chinese components. And I hope and PRAY for the day that we no longer import a single anything from them. Please people, buy American made goods whenever and wherever you can and lets put as much pressure as possible on Washington to get us away from the punitive tax code that has driven so many great companies out of America.
Too bad I already own an 870. No complaints. America F*CK YEAH!
I purchased one of the 982’s from Bud’s a couple of months ago, expecting something that could be used for home defense, but couldn’t meet the demands of heavy use. WRONG! These things are made of STEEL and built like a tank. I was amazed when I examined the “fit & finish”, this does not at all look like “bargin basement”! F & F were and are perfect, and ‘most aftermarket add-ons for the 870 work perfectly. Now you must focus on the Model Number, NOT the brand name! Hawk makes them , as does Savage, Stevens, and others. The “982” is the constant marking no matter the MFG. and Interstate is the distributor.
I learned something else interesting, Model 320 Savage & Stevens are identical EXCEPT the Mdl 320/920, while having a full fixed butt stock, also adds a fixed pistol grip. At that time there was only $10 difference in the price. One can’t question the stability gained or the recoil reduction when the pistol grip is aded to a fixed full stock. I sentout mailings to all my friends.
G-ManX — There is a link RIGHT below the notification that the item is currently out of stock…in a giant red box…next to a giant red exclamation point. It says Please click here to be notified by email if this product becomes available. What more do you want?
WOW” is right” ,Roy M….. G-ManX is 110% Right on the head , here and I think you All Know Just” what he`s talking about here , whether you wanta admit it or not. That`s what Most American`s do , and ESP: the American Bis. Man …. Re: the ole saying go`s …. Ya SCREW you Friends to Death” , cause your enemys will never call ya . You decive everyone , and anyway you can” , but the main thing is to close the deal. It`s Not” a Good Christian thing to do fellow`s but the sad fact is, That MOST” people in America are not very good Christian`s in the first place . O~Sure there is a few that go to church on Sunday Mornings and clame to Live it and Breath it , Esp: the one sitting down along the front row waving there hands back and forth…. And Prase The Lord and on and on , then when the most of those you see there leave Church” , They can`t WAIT” to get outa there and act like a buncha heathen`s…. (There Normal Daily Selfs) ….. trying to run over you before you even leave the parking lot. Yup …. Real Christians , Yeah Right” ,… I call them Sunday Morning Christian`s , because most of those people you see around you there , are PURE Class One Certified Heathen`s , going about there daily heathen afairs the other six days a week , No matter Where you live , or what State you live in. It`s a Real Life Fact” if you all wanta admit it or not . I no it ….And I think G-ManX knows it, but most just turn there head and egnore it ! There will come a time” Fellows , when a lot of rich evil people will be forced to pass through the Eye Of The Needle” to gain entrance to the Holy Land” , where ALL people live it and breath it Every Day . I hope none of You” are of that rich and evil spirit .
Magnum 6 here is what you get when chewing tobacco, cheap beer, and holier than thou water are all ingested to excess….
One world / one economy….
Wow , don’t beat each other up for buying or not buying American guns. One thing for sure is everyone one contributing to these posts is patriotic or they wouldn’t bother posting their thoughts. In my view you are buying American when you buy from American dealers. It sure keeps those American folks working. If I only bought American I wouldn’t have any Mausers, AK’s, Enfields or Arisakas. It’s all good.
How clever. I’ve got to say that without your explanation I would never have figured that routine out on my own. Instead of heading the page with the lower price and stating “Out Of Stock” like most other sites do, the page instead inserts the higher priced item from an alternative distributor with a link. At a glance, it appears to be the original items price. It’s not until midway down the page that it informs the shopper the item they were really looking for is “Out Of Stock”. Regardless, nowhere does it list the original item’s lower price. Worse, it definitely does not provide a link to be notified when the lower priced item becomes available. I feel bad that others outside of this post will not be afforded the opportunity to learn about this method of requesting notification on the lower priced item. But then again, how could they know to ask for it if it is never listed, nor a request link provided? This serves to exemplify my original comments regarding how the industry is run and getting beat by foreign competition.
Note: We sell the item number linked to in this post for $177.08. The distributor we use for item number is currently sold out. There is a link on that item to the same model from a different distributor who sells it for $197.99. If you want to save the 20 bucks, just use this link to be notified when item number 91401 is available from the original distributor.
Hey commenter #4, that American ingenuity has been out-sourced to China. And to commenter #1, why is it always the duty of the consumer to buy American regardless of the money grubbing gouge factor? Why is it always the consumer that is made to look un-patriotic for being savvy enough to buy economically sound guns regardless of origin? When does the American industry become viewed as un-patriotic for being out smarted and under sold or just plain greedy? It should be the duty of the industry to remain competitive by dropping prices and developing innovative processes in order to stay competitive. Case and point, even the author writes the shotgun is valued at $175, yet when you click the CTD link it is listed for $197.99. I’ll let you all ponder that one for a bit.
I guess that means Mossberg better get their act together if they want to compete. Where is that American ingenuity?
Why all the animosity guys? I’m not sure, but hasn’t Interstate Arms been importing guns for a long time? And Norinco is on many AK-7s and SKSs. I don’t know about home defense, but if it functions well enough not to jam and get you killed, the gun may fill a niche for some folks. I have two really nice 870s; a modified chocked 20ga Magnum Light Weight, and an improved cyl .410, both Wingmasters with vent ribs and the nicer blue and wood of yester-year. I let go of the beautiful 12ga Magnum Waterfowler 1100 I had, then had a Winchester 12 auto loader stolen, sothe only 12 I have left is an H&R topper. Nowadays, I really like the idea of a good Parkerized finish, because of sweat and dirt. I want a gun I don’t have to baby when I’m working on my property mowing, cutting wood, or driving to the store. Bluing is pretty, but I really like my Colt Agent that’s Parkerized. You’d be amazed what it picks up in my belt holster after mowing a couple of acres. If you could pay even a little more and have Parkerized, and if all the accessories. For 870 would fit the 982, I’d be tempted. It seems the ones who’ve posted about buying one really like them. Like I said, as long as the action is smooth and reliable if used for home defense. I guess time will tell. I’m sure we’ll see more on this.
Communism is the future
Glad to see the American consumers are strongly supporting a Communist regieme. For another $90.00 you can buy and American made Mossberg 500 Pursuader, from CTD. But, I guess no matter what the item, money is the all important factor. I mean, why would ANYONE want to support an American manufacturer when they can support the communists?