I’ve pretty much stepped back on the first of the new generation of bullpup pump guns, notably the Kel-Tec KSG and the Turkish UTS-15 for a whole bunch of reasons, including ergonomics, unproven systems and, frankly, reports from people I trust that the guns still have hit-or-miss problems (that’s a gunwriter euphemism for, “They don’t work”).
I saw a prototype of a third next-gen pump at the NRA Show, but, honestly, didn’t pay that much attention to it. I did think it odd that the shotgun, the DP-12, was coming from Connecticut Shotgun Manufacturing Co., CSMC, (doing business as Standard Manufacturing LLC), the foremost manufacturer of premium double-barreled shotguns in America.
CSMC got its start making Winchester Custom Shop Model 21s, the iconic American side-by-side double. From that it’s expanded to multiple lines of high-end doubles, including its top-of-the-line A. H. Fox guns that rival its much older Italian and English competitors. Using modern manufacturing techniques combined with old fashion hand-work craftsmanship, CSMC has brought high-end classic shotguns into reach for a much wider audience.
CSMC seemed to me to be an unlikely company to step into the “black bullpup shotgun” market. We were already headed to CSMC for the shotguns and to feature another eclectic product, the 3/4 scale .22 LR “Tommy Gun” I’d also seen at the NRA show… a friend of mine asked me to take a close look at the DP-12 while I was there.
The two other entries in the field, the KSG and the UTS-15, both take a similar path—a single barrel fed by two separate 7-round tubes, the Kel-Tec tubes on the bottom of the barrel; the UTS-15 tubes on top. The UTS-15 has user-selectable tubes, while the KSG has to be manually shifted to the second tube when the first is empty. A lot of my concerns focused on those systems that shifted from tube to tube. I really liked the SRM semi-auto system with its manually operated rotary tubes (didn’t like the high MSRP’s, however).
The DP-12 goes down a completely different, and decidedly unconventional, path. It has two 7-round tubes, but it also has two barrels! That’s right… a double-barrel pump gun. Two rounds are chambered with each pump; the trigger is then pulled two times, the first to fire the right barrel, the second to fire the left barrel. Pump, and you’ve got two more rounds.
Essentially, CSMC made the decision to combine two time-proven systems—the pump shotgun, which we’ve had down since the 1890s, and the single-trigger double-barrel shotgun, which is easily as old. CSMC is building some of the best double-barrel shotguns in the world. They understand shotgun triggers on a DNA level. The two separate pumps are likewise conventional; think two Remington 870s bolted together.
Okay, that’s different! CSMC approached the design with the same manufacturing philosophy it uses for all its shotguns—start with a big honking piece of metal and work from there. CSMC already manufactures its own barrels, drilled, not hammer-forged, on steel bars, using custom drill bits designed to minimize chatter and deliver a smoother bore. The receiver for the DP-12 is machined from a solid block of aluminum. Overall, the gun is built like a tank.
When I first handled the double-barrel pump, the pump system felt like an 870, a real gun rather than a tactical Super Soaker. It looks clunky, but the bullpup doesn’t feel clunky when shouldered. In fact, it feels like nothing so much as an FNH FS-2000 bullpup carbine, which I have a lot of rounds through. It’s got rails in the appropriate places, an AR standard safety, threaded barrels for chokes or breachers, and it loads like those two 870s bolted together.
The trigger is fine — probably shouldn’t be surprised at that considering CSMC’s core competence. My question was how was I going to adapt to pull-pull-pump. Keep in mind that I shoot a double barrel in cowboy competition and have literally thousands of rounds through my Browning BSS in the course of a year. I also compete in 3-Gun Heavy Metal, which requires a 12-gauge pump. For that I shoot a Benelli Nova, which handles a lot clunkier than the DP-12, by the way.
I got a chance to run two 16-round load sets through the gun: one high-brass field loads; one heavier self-defense loads. Here are my initial impressions: The pull-pull-pump proved to be a non-issue. It took about six rounds to dial it in. The caveat is that I would need a lot more rounds in a training/competition-pressure environment to see how the DP-12 truly performs.
There is simply no faster follow-up shot than just pulling the trigger. That’s why dangerous-game hunters use double rifles. Even a semi-auto action has to cycle for the next shot. On the pull-pull, I ran the gun the same way I run a double in competition, firing the second shot the instant the trigger resets.
The pump is short and precise, easy to run. The forearm has a raised area on the front to keep the pump hand from sliding forward. The test gun I shot had a vertical foregrip attached.
The bullpup configuration, an excellent recoil pad, and the weight of the gun (I’m guessing around 8 pounds) made recoil a non-issue. To me, the gun balances extremely well (again, think FS-2000). It’s fat, but you don’t notice when it’s on the shoulder.
The bullpup configuration makes the shotgun extremely maneuverable, much more so than a standard-length gun. I have worked shoot-houses with 870s, ARs, and other rifles, and the bullpup really comes into its own in a confined space.
Conclusions? I really think the DP-12 has a lot of potential, enough that I’ve asked for a Testing and Evaluation gun to give it a full workout and film it for Down Range TV. I might not want to carry this gun to Afghanistan, but it would be one heck of a bedroom gun with tube No. 1 loaded with Hornady Tap buckshot and tube No. 2 loaded with Federal law-enforcement slugs. I’m thinking in that situation, I win. It also has huge potential as a car gun and for other close-quarters situations. The DP-12 is based on proven technology, and there’s no strange Rube Goldberg engineering to sneak up and bite the user on the butt.
The questions I have are on topping up the mag, reloading, and, in general, the entire manual of arms, but I think those are solvable with a few hands-on days to work out the techniques. Bullpups require a different manual of arms from other guns we’re familiar with. I’m going through that with the Tavor; it’s not bad, it’s just different.
I know how the DP-12 is made because I walked through the entire process, and the quality is really impressive. That’s important to me, and it should be important to you.
My understanding is (as seen in the flyer above) is that the DP-12 will be exclusively distributed by Cheaper Than Dirt!, and the MSRP will be in the $1k region, although that is not fixed at this point. I don’t have an ETA on the sale of the DP-12, but I do know for a fact that it is currently in full production.
Is the DP-12 a shotgun you’d consider buying? Tell us why, or why not, in the comment section.
[mbane]
Damn, ya’ll must be really paranoid!
IS THERE ANY TIME DELAY BETWEEN PULLING THE FIRST TRIGGER AND THE SECOND TRIGGER AND IF SO HOW MANY SECONDS BEFORE YOU CAN PULL THE SECOND TRIGGER ON THE DP-12 PUMP DOUBLE BARREL SHOT GUN. ALSO I SEEN ONE IN A GUN SHOP IN HOUSTON, TEXAS AND LIKED THE FEEL AND LOOKS OF IT. I LIVE IN MISSOURI AND WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHERE I COULD PURCHASE THE DP-12. ANY INFORMATION WOULD BE MUCH APPRECIATED.
WILL STEEL SHOT, 00 BUCK SHOT OR SLUGS HURT THE BARRELS OF A DP 12 SHOT GUN???
The DP-12 shotgun is like double barreled 1911 pistol, it is fun to watch it, it is fun to shoot it but I see no reason for buying one 🙂 But it looks awesome and shooter is going to have a lot of fun.
YES! That is yes I want one! I have a mossy cruiser and a very modest ‘normal’ firearm selection of (3) big bore revolvers, a .45 1911, a AR15, and a rem 30.06. However last year I lost my leg (a full leg amp) and so my firearm/self defense needs have changed, that is I am leaning more to close range self defense than rec. long range shooting. The DP-12 looks like something I would have designed for my own use! The only thing I would like to see is a panic selector switch to fire both barrels at once! YEOW!!! I know, but I am an old combat vet and now weigh near 300 pounds. So as soon as I can sell a couple of my firearms like the two S&W stainless .38 spec to offset the cost I’ll have one before the election.
There’s also the Crye Six12 Bullpup Revolver SBS Modular Shotgun. Which can be mounted under the Barrel of a Car-4 or ANY AR or AK rifle. Comes in 12.5-inch, 18-inch and 22-inch barrel configurations…
Hi was wondering is this Dp12 legal in New York state I’m thinking of purchasing ,
Hi Richard,
We do not sell firearms to New York, I’m sorry.
I would strongly recommend checking out the UTAS UTS15. I have owned one for several years and have used it for two personal defense courses, sporting clays (there are better choices), and hunting turkey (I’m 2 for 2).s It has the 15 round capacity of the DP12 (but only one barrel), side port ejection, and an AR type safety. It weighs just under 7 lbs. Gun Tests magazine had a write-up on the DP12 a couple of issues ago. You can find a synopsis on their website. They gave it high marks for the coolness factor, and it is well made (by Connecticut Shotgun), but they weren’t impressed in the way it handled.
Do you sell to Maryland? I’d love to have one of these.
@ Pavel Svinchnik
Yes you can order one in Maryland. It’s only available through CTD.
@ Frank
Your Welcome, Sir!
CTD…you know that you are playing into California’s ant- gun bullpucky by refusing to ship here…this is exactly what they WANT you to do…so please help us out and ship your guns HERE!!! Stand up for our rights as Americans!
@ spike
Do you guy’s ever bother reading any other comments. I left you guy’s the information you would need to get one. Just read it, it’s on this page. Just look below this one
Hey thanks guys…I actually did read all of the stuff and I did buy one from Standard Mfg. (ah fig-urd dit oud muh selv!) It clears Cali waiting list on 24th can’t wait… I have already fondled it at my FFL before they put it into 10 day Cali hyper-sleep it’s awesome ….I appreciate your comments and help…long live the 2nd!
@ Spike
I was beginning to give up hope if anyone was going to read them!
@ spike.
I see the (TSL/CTD) Redacted the comment already.
1. Read, GunAmerica. com
2. Read, CtGunTalkForm. com
3. Buy through, Cali B&M
FYI: ANYONE IN CALIFORNIA INTERESTED IN PURCHASING THE DP-12 DBL. PUMP SHOTGUN.
Check out GunAmerica. com and CTGunTalkForum. com.
But by all indications, the answer is YES. You Purchase/Own the DP-12 Shotgun in California. But be warned Shipping and Handling is going to be the KILLER in any Sale.
Okay! California…you tell me why I can’t have one of these?
When can you adjust the DP-12 to fit California’s laws. I want one of these and it seems that if you just block the magazines to load only 10 rounds “they” can’t quibble
@ P Michael Coon.
You can order the DP-12 Shotgun in California through Cali B&M, they’ll set you up…
Yes, this is a shotgun I would buy. However I won’t even entertain the thought of buying it. Why? An exclusive only. No way. That keeps the price jacked up. In the last 3 months I have bought a KSG and a Tavor, because competition drove the prices down.
The DP-12 should meet the requirements of a legal firearm in California (for now). CTD does not ship firearms to California because of California’s nuances. How do I get a DP-12 legally shipped to a legal FFL retailer in California?
Is the company that makes the DP-12 known for being responsive to the owner of their firearms should repairs or replacements be necessary? I saw a You-Tube about a manufacturer’s problem servicing a high-end 12-16 and it got me thinking about the service end of things.
Thank you
@ Frank.
Sounds, less like a Warning and more like an Apology. Are they Cutting Corners in the Manufacturing to Meet and Fulfill Customer Order’s?
@ Frank.
Look Up-Stair’s, four comment’s and you’re Prayer’s will be ANSWERED.
@ Frank.
You can order it through Cali B&M.
Why won’t the cheaper than dirt website let me order one to California. It’s cal legal just like the kel tec ksg??
@ joe gerlach.
Just go to Cali B&M an order through them!
Has any thinking about using this double on Hogs?I want to buy one soon .
I’m definitely getting in line for this one. It’s not only a great weapon, but it’s a work of art also.
Can’t wait until we have the chance to purchase them.
Paul
Its not the gun makers fault that u don’t make enought to buy this great shotgun.at the price they’re asking they will fly out the door to gun buyers who knows a great self defense gun when they see it.I hope to own one myself soon but I would like to see a automatic double barrel
I’m fairly certain that the first 30,000 units are already spoken for. By employee’s of CTD, Presentation Guns, Gifts, and other Promotional Whatever’s. I’d be very much surprised before the first actual customer sale is made before 2016.
I was at SHOT and spoke with the fellas from Standard and they assured me that they had already delivered 30k units to CTD and didn’t have any sales info for me. Any new ETA?
Why not fire both barrels at once as long as you have two loaded? the alternating firing first one then on a second trigger pull seems to increase complication. I’m still waiting for a compact semi auto / Manual pump, and large magazine that can survive under the back seat of the truck lile my old Remington 870. A magazine for quick reloading for a police / military use and a four round magazine is plenty of fire power for self defence.
tao
That would require going back in time to sometime before 1986, manufacturing the DP12 capable of firing both barrels with one trigger pull, registering it as a Machine Gun in the NFA. THEN you could buy one today legally (for probably 10-15 grand … plus the $200 tax stamp).
I received the CTD catalog and laid eyes upon the dp12 yesterday. I instantly went to ctd’s website to buy it and it’s not available. This gun is advertised as better than the ksg and uts15 which I own. From the start, the pricing is the same and the availability is the same as when the others were introduced. That is unfortunate. I’m here in ft worth so I can go locally to purchase it. If the prices go up when they barely produce any I’m out. Why advertise what isn’t even available? Technical problems? Production issues? It’s a real put off. I waited a few generations for my uts15 because of those issues and I seriously hope this is not headed the same way.
Actually it is very common to to advertise new models before they go into full production — the recent Shooting, Hunting, Outdoor Trade (SHOT) show in Las Vegas, was full of new products not yet in full production. However, the at Media and Testing day, 2,000 journalists and buyers all took a hand at firing 16 shots each. At the end of the day, all five test models were still on the firing line and functioning… Keep in touch, these will be available very soon!
So any word on the release date yet?
I do not have a firm date, but I am forwarding a request to the powers that be for more information. I will do my best to get an update posted this week. ~Dave Dolbee
Yes, I would consider buying the DP-12 shotgun but due to this economy, I cant afford the MSRP of $1,395.00 thats exclusive from Cheaper Than Dirt. So much for cheap!!! Thats just too much money for what I make. I used to make in the 30k/yr range as a health care worker for 21 yrs. But with this president and the so called Affordable Care Act, Im not even in health care anymore. Im now driving a school bus for $10,000/yr. Thanks, Mr President, for redistributing the little that I had!!!
I’d really like to know why CTD won’t just offer the gun. Seriously, why not sell the damn thing; its unAmerican not to. Is CTD unAmerican? I want the DP12 … it’s literally my next gun. Time to find a new seller.
It’s pretty sad that CTD is keeping the release date of this shrouded in a mystery. Just bought a KSG last week. I will buy one of these once the company wakes up and sells the DP12 through other businesses instead of letting CTD monopolize the process and play games with us consumers. Now I know why so many people despise CTD as much as they do.
Yes, I’m not just considering, I want one now. Why? Isn’t that obvious? Where can I get one? Just did a search on CTD and nothing. Went camping near Kite Lake, CO last summer and had a bear in our camp. While the 44 mag was comforting to have, the DP12 would have worked better on my nearvs.
Awesome, I definitely want to get my hands on a DP12!! When will it be available?
I looked at the UTS AND KELTECH guns and cane to several similar conclusions and from what I have read here yes I would ccertainly give the Dp-12 serious thought.I wonder if in the future it will be available in 20 gauge I know alot of female police officers will buy a 20 gauge version of the standard 12 used by their department and use that for patrol
Don’t know about CTD, but on Standard MFG’s web site they have a shopping cart. http://store-jxztkc.mybigcommerce.com/dp-12/
Have you begun selling the DP-12 yet? I keep looking for the opportunity to buy one. I would like to be notified when you have it ready to sell.
What is the effective range for this gunumber?
YES ID UY IF THE PRICE POINT ISNT FOR THE RICH AND FAMOUS.
Well it’s been almost 4 months…and still no new news about a release date?? What’s up with that?? I was hoping they’d release these during the Christmas rush. Oh well…I’ll put this on my “I want” list…right next to a new full-auto MP-5!
It seems that CTD is playing games with us consumers. I see countless videos of this being used at Shot Show. The company who made the DP12 really messed up by giving CTD the only rights to sell it.
Mez be wantin one – soon.
Micheal if your testing shows the 12ga. bull pup dependable, I would be very interested. I think it is a very good choice for self defense, racking a regular 870 is sure to clear the hallway. Racking a double barreled short nosed 870×2 should clear the entire property!
Please inform when avalible for sale, This would make a great home defence weapon
What about us lefties???
r
I love my KSG because its ambidextrous in nature with ejection downwards.
It’s my go-to gun, with a mounted shotgun-compatible laser sight and 620-lumen flashlight on it’s rails.
However, if I can get a better built, stronger, more reliable gun, with those same features…here’s my thousand dollars.
Make it a reliable semi-auto with a slide-fire stock…here’s my two grand.
When can I buy one. I want it NOW !
I will order one on day one of sales. Now, when will that be?
$850-$900 and accesorizid for $1100 would be acceptable
Let me know when CTD will start selling them.
Sound me an E-mail
I am still trying to figure out a practical use, for myself, for one of these.
Don’t get me wrong–there is a “cool” factor here, but I can build two AR-type carbines for the cost of one of these “cool” shotguns at $1K.
Stop looking for “practical uses” for this thing … its a range toy … it for S**ts&Giggles, its for FUN (something too many folk in the shooting community forget about).
Not every gun has to have a practical use (although to be honest putting smile on one’s face in these dark days seems like a pretty practical use to me)
It’s not a range toy, it’s a very, VERY practical and highly effective way to open bean cans in half the time of opening bean cans with a regular shotgun.
I’m starting to fear this thing will be vapor though. Announcement in October, no DP-12 for sale yet. Come ON people, I have a big pile of bean cans that need opening, and I’m killing myself having to open them all with a single barrel pump 12 gauge. I’m, like, getting carpal tunnel and stuff! Sheesh!
Heck Ya I’d buy one after reading a few more reviews and seeing it in action. I have a UTAS and I love it. And there customer service is awesome thye had me send the gun in and they replaced the mono block and the rail on top with much better parts that were causing issues. After I got it back it’s shot like a champ!
I’d love to own one…how much?
What is the price for the DP-12? It’s January when is it going to be sold? Are current customers going to be given advanced notice?
I don’t think they plan to sell to the average “joe’s/jane’s”. There trying to lure in the Blue-Bloods and get their money instead. After all after six-months, and they still haven’t set a price for the gun, probable means it’s going to be expensive.
I’d pay up to a grand for one … I just hope CTD doesn’t do something stupid like not sell it here in Colorado because they’re taking the overly cautions interpretation of the gawdawful new gun laws.
The tubes count as TWO magazines here an Colorado so this gun is legal to sell here (there’s plenty of gun shops with KSGs and UTS-15s in them so this should be sold here).
I would absolutely buy one. It sounds like CSMC didn’t reinvent the wheel, just put two of the together and came out with a product built on a p proven system. Hope some day i can afford one and there just as available as and 870 at the local gun shop
I would buy one for a grand
I like the looks of the DP 12 the way it functions. I would buy one if the price is reasonable.
@ Tony Outlaw.
Connecticut Shotgun Manufacturing Company, only produces 375 shotgun per year, on average. And those that they produce, are Custom Specialized Shotguns for the RICH ($$$$$).
The DP-12 is their attempt to Semi-Mass Produce a “virtually” indestructible shotgun out of “billeted” 7075-T651 grade Aluminium. Top-of-the-Line, Aluminium.
T-Ball MSRP. is set at $1,000.00 USD., and considering the type of aluminium their using and how it being produced. You’re probably looking at around $1,500.00 to $2,000.00 USD. and that a conservative price estimate. It could be higher.
And, considering that CTD is exclusive seller, doesn’t mean their going to be selling to the “average Joe”. They may be trying to attract Rich Buyer’s into their CTD’s buyer’s program…
“Reasonable” like so many terms is a “relitive” descriptor.
If reasonable is 1K to 2K for this platform then I applaud your ability to have that kind of disposable income at your disposal!
Most, I’m thinking, are in the $700 to $900 “reasonable” range …..
But to each his own, I think nothing of spending $$$ on long distance platforms and the optics to match. If pa double pumper is on your wish list you’ll find a way to it.
Anyone know what type/brand the choke tubes are tapped for? Benelli, Remington, Invector, etc?
I will probably buy one, if the price is reasonable.
Really like the look, very interesting shotgun.
Something to add to my collection.
have UTS love it,probably will try this one too.
I have read every post,and come away thinking that this shotgun is going to be a flop.The reason is that everything I read is downing this firearm.All
I wish that the big American would have come up with this ideal.We all talk about the import companies with the straight-pull rifles,why can’t some American companies come this version in slug gun or a double rifle.Then I will stand line for one.
@ Allen Williams.
I think your RIGHT. This is a “Go For Broke” moment for CSMC, Connecticut Shotgun Manufacturing Company. In a 13-year period, CSMC produced ~79,000 shotguns of various models. Between 2008 through 2011, they produced just 6,100 shotguns. Speculations is that, that number has dropped to just 345 shotguns per year. This Company is dying, and they need to do something on a major scale, too keep from going broke. So, they decided to produce a VIRTUALLY INDESTRUCTIBLE SHOTGUN made of 7075-T6-grade Billeted Aluminium, in Semi-Mass Production just to stay solvent. That’s why everybody is stay Tight-Lipped about the PRICE, and that’s why the Minimum MSRP. is set at $1,000.00 USD. Their probably not going to be producing more the 1,000 or 2,000 units per year, so don’t expect any sharp price drops anytime soon, if ever. This Company produces Specialized Shotguns for the Select Few, they DON’T Mass-Produce for the general public. Good work Allen…
I would buy one tomorrow, but the msrp of 1k is too high for a bedroom gun. Remember, any firearm used in self defense is going to be confiscated. I think I’ll just stick with the $300.00 870.
@ rread.
May, I suggest the Super Shorty 20-Gauge 2+1, instead for your bedroom protection need. It even comes with an optional Holster.
Way to go, negative Nelly!
Gun confistication will be near zero, because we are not a bunch of N.N. scaredy cats.
I’d buy one for $1,000 or a bit more, but be sure and pre-order as soon as you can, folks!
I like the DP12 for protection. Also I hope this shotgun become a sportive
Version,another thing are they rifled barrels?
@ Allen Williams.
We have a 3-dimensional object called the DP-12 Double-Barreled Pump-Action Billeted-Aluminium Shotgun, and if you took all the know information about it, you might just about cover the jacket of a Match Book Cover.
Would like to see a longer barrel version as this could be a very compelling skeet gun
Looks like an interesting gun.I would wait and see how it performs in the real world.Where did all these people come up with the 37 lb. weight. The article say it weights about 8 lb.
@ craig.
If you read the Connecticut Shotgun article on the DP-12 shotgun. The wrighter is GUESSING at the weight to be 8-pound. It doesn’t say it WEIGHTS 8-pounds, but only GUESSING at the weight of 8-pounds.
Yes the author said it weighted ABOUT 8 lb. after handling the shot gun.That is a long way from 37 lb.I still don’t know where you came up with that weight. Have you put this gun on a scale or are you GUESSING at the weight
@ craig.
It say’s that in the the Shooter’s Log article, NOT in the Connecticut Shotgun PR article. Your going to have to Goggle the information, off-the-website. And read everything else of the Goggle Web-Space to get the rest of the information. It should only take you a couple of day’s, too read through it all… Because, most of the information is BURIED, consider it a SCAVENGER HUNT.
@ craig.
If you look a my question to CTD/The Shooter’s Log, its phased as a question. I didn’t say it weights 37-lbs. I asked if it weighed 37-lbs? I asked a question! The NeoStead 2000 @ 8.6-lbs empty, the Kel-Tec KSG @ 6.9-lbs empty and the UTAS UTS-15 @ 6.9-lbs empty. All have one thing in common their made of Polymer and Stamped or CNC Steel. The DP-12, with the exception of the barrels in made entirely of Billeted 7075-T6 grade Aluminium, making it virtually indestructible. Which means its going to be HEAVY. Anything made of Billeted Aluminium is going to be heavy, I doubt they billeted as thin as an aircraft’s skin fuselage. They could have used stamped aluminium for that. I’m guess between 12 to 15-lbs, empty.
so the question is when this one is being released to the market. I’m in the process of buying a shotgun now; was about to buy the Kel-tec until I saw this review.
@ Eva.
Yeah, well that the $64,000 Question. Nothing new about it on Goggle, The Firearms Blog or anywhere else. Just go new CTD catalog, NOTHING. Not A Peep. Black Friday or Christmas maybe…
Eva,
The KSG is much better than this writer makes it out to be. In fact, all he provides is some vague rumor of “problems” with the KSG.
The initial run had an issue with the trigger not resetting properly. Kel-Tec fixed that. The only other issue I have heard of – not seen – is the lower rail, which is plastic as it is formed as the bottom of the fore-end. As I indicated, this is only a problem if you put on a vertical grip (as some folks mount on their Ar-15s). If the grip is held close to the bottom and pressed or pulled too hard while racking the slide, I think it _could_ snap off of the plastic rail.
The answer is simple: hold the grip high, close to the rail, or use one of the other mods like the Magpul angle grip, the KSG angled grip or their “hand-stop (http://www.keltecweapons.com/ksg/ksg-accessories/) or one of the other aftermarket add-ons made for the KSG to keep your hand from sliding forward off of the fore-end when you rack it firmly. Then there should be zero issues with it.
I have a vertical grip on mine and have put quite a few rounds (75 so far) through my KSG, and there are no changes in the rail, no issues at all.
BTW, the KSG weighs only 6.9 lbs empty and 8.5 lbs with fifteen rounds (fourteen in the mags and one chambered). If the DP-12 actually weighs anywhere near 37 lbs, I’d run in the other direction.
Kel-Tec’s web site indicates an MSRP of $990 at this time, so if it is available elsewhere for $700-$800, that sounds like a good deal. I am not at all upset about paying $995 for mine, although I certainly would have enjoyed paying less 🙂 I’m really pleased with it. I’ve been shooting and reloading for over forty years, and spent fifteen years in law enforcement (San Diego Police Department, California Highway Patrol, and a couple of small departments donating time as a reserve peace officer.
Here is an excellent review of the KSG: http://www.gunblast.com/KelTec-KSG.htm
thanks for the review this seems like the perfect self protection weapon for family and home
I wish u could have both barrels fire at once
@ jason.
I’m a wheelchair driver, and just fire one barrel, in some cases will make me go TURTLE. Now, compound that with a 37-pound Double-Barreled Shotgun with both barrels going at once, will send me through a wall…
@Jason
Please trust me when I tell you that you really don’t want to unload both barrels simultaneously! It’s uncomfortable, very loud and creates a very disrupted strike pattern.
There was an attempt by I believe IRA out of Brazil (not to sure about that) to make a dual fire side-by-side some years ago. They recognized that barrel #1 must fire and then a millisecond after the #2 must fire so to stagger the shots just enough that they don’t interfere with each other. I think they ended up with an O/U that used a single trigger. It fired barrel #1 and then had some kind of impact or recoil initiated trip system to fire barrel #2. I don’t think they ever got it quite right.
I have experienced a duel discharge from a 12ga coach gun and it’s not pleasant experience. I certainly wouldn’t want it to happen on purpose. Saw it happen on a range in Thailand back in the day with a S/S 10ga, pistol griped and 11-inch barrels…… belonged to a tunnel rat, damn near broke his wrist and set him back a step or two. It was a sympathetic discharge but quite the surprise.
If you want that kind of close in, down range fire power get an auto loader. Just saying . . .
I waited around a year before I tried to get one, asking my local gun store to let me know if they ever got one in. Three months ago they got a couple from Kel-Tec, at the price I mentioned. Wish I had waited. The extra bucks would have bought extra ammo, plus I would have liked one in Flat Dark Earth or OD Green instead of black.
I know some folks here who bought one not long after they first came out. They paid – true story – $1600, because they wanted one that badly, and they were so hard to get that the going price was that high.
Again, I like mine. I’ve got Magpul BUIS on it, and may add a red dot or Eotech someday. The D-12 sounds like fun, and a double trigger pull is faster than pumping a second round, but that extra barrel has to add a couple of pounds. I’d stick with the KSG, especially since the price has come down to what Kel-Tec originally said it would cost.
@ RegT.
Nobody likes getting BURNED on what they perceive to be a great deal. Several months ago, I went to a local gun show in the WDC Tri-State area. The was a guy, calling himself Honest Dave. And he was selling 98k Mausers in 7.92x57mm, what they actually were. Was Argentine 98k Mausers in 7.65×53 Arg. Worst of all, they have been sitting in a warehouse near the ocean for 50 plus years. They so corroded, they totally useless. The pristine wood stock promised me, were so dried out that it fell apart in my hands. I paid $555.55 USD. for something that wasn’t worth 2-cents in scrap. So cheer-up, it not the end of the world, yet. But it does at times, feel like it.
yes I will buy one of these. I really like the one pump double trigger pull. It should last much longer wish two barrels. And it seems like they let the other two out of the gate first then found out their problems and figured out what would make it a better all around gun than the other two. And as of this week you can buy a KSG for what it is worth at buds guns. $700 for black $800 for the other colors. I have shot them both and tended to like them as I shot a lot of multi gun and in a shoot house they will not be grabbed as you round a corner and be takin away from you. At $700 the Kel-Tec is a great choice. For $1000 and up they can sit on the shelf and I will build another MKA 1919 for my matches. The MKA once moded out works very well but it is nothing like a bullpup thank you
@ CTD/The Shooter’s Log.
Are the facts correct, in that the DP-12 Shotgun, even made from 7075-grade Billeted Aluminium weights in at 37-pounds. Is that a TYPO, or TRUE weight. If true, RETOOL and make it out of Billeted Magnesium. Which is just a strong as 7000-series Aluminium, but weights 1/3 a much or ~12-lbs, 5-oz…
You……”Would this be DIS-Honest Dave’s Gun Emporium, because the MSRP. is suppose to be $799.99 USD.” Where are you getting this info from?
@ Lucas.
I’m refering to the Kel-Tec KSG shotgun @ $799.99 USD., not to the DP-12 shotgun @ ~$1,000.00 USD.
Where are you getting this information from?
@ Lucas.
Who is the question direct too?
Have to correct you on the KSG. You do _not_ have to empty one magazine before using the other. There is a selector lever that you can switch any time you like.
As the KSG’s street price runs ~ $1K (the ones that make it into your local gun store, at least), that price for the DP-12 shouldn’t be that objectionable. I like my KSG, with the proviso that I worry about the plastic lower rail. Hasn’t failed me yet, but I wish Kel-Tec had embedded a metal rail into the plastic fore-end.
@ RegT.
Would this be DIS-Honest Dave’s Gun Emporium, because the MSRP. is suppose to be $799.99 USD.
Secundius,
I’ve never bought a gun on-line. All the gun stores in my area were selling the KSG for $995 when they could get them in (Kel-Tec production wasn’t keeping up with demand until just recently). I bought mine about three months ago, so that may well have changed. I haven’t paid attention to current prices. Glad to hear they have dropped.
Also, the problems mentioned with the KSG – mainly the trigger reset issue – have been addressed, although I believe the plastic picatinny rail on the fore-end is still a weak spot. If you attach something like the Magpul angled fore-end accessory, there isn’t a problem, but long vertical grips can produce too much force via leverage, and reportedly have snapped the lower rail on several KSGs.
The metal rail on top is just fine.
@ RegT.
Gun Brokers.com, has the Kel-Tek KSG in OD Green for $700.00 USD. and others starting at $769.95 USD.
Just wishing that Cheaper than dirt would not be the only distributor. I have done some purchases thru them only to find their prices were higher. On other items, they were way higher. I feel giving them exclusive would cause price gouging. I own a Keltec ksg and purchased it right after release for $699 thru gunbroker. Would love to get, but I will not pay a premium.
I am in the market for a home defense close quarters type of shotgun such as Kel Tec’s KSG or Utas’ UTS15 Bullpup design. Many reviewers I have already observed over the last three to four years now have helped to improve those manufacturers design flaws. Now I honestly am hoping to hear more about your DP12 as it provides almost a better convergence of understanding home defense needs, sport shooting, hunting, and tactical advantages in one shotgun platform. However, caution must be met with proven perfomance. I would love to hear more about your product and how well professionals that are independent of your company rate the dp12. Note I want truth over excitement of potential sales and hype. When you have a great and revolutionary product it will sell. I anticipate this may be one of those able to compete well. I look forward to further information.
I will buy one they come available,plus I wish the sporting arms companies set up and take notice.Companies like Remington Arms ,Can you see a870 Remington double barrel slug gun?I can.
@ Allen W.
It’s worth noting that Remington did build a Double-Barreled, Single-Pump Action 12-Gauge 870 Shot Gun. Called the Remington 1740, but I don’t think it ever got beyond the Prototype Stage. It also weights ~30-lbs.
Also worth noting OLEG VOLK, of the AR-57 Website. Evaluated and tested the DP-12 in this website. Just thought you guy’s might like to know…
Want one when will it be available and price
@ C.V.
The Firearm Blog, still has the price set a ~$,1000.00 USD., if not more. Sorry, about that…
Looks amazing, I’d love to have one.
when is it available and price?
TAKE MY MONEY!!!
Sounds really great! How much $$. I’ve been thinking on a home defense shotgun and this sure fits the bill. Hold lots of rounds too!! I really like the idea of a pump.
I want one! Let me know when available…………
I want this for Christmas. please!
I holding out for the AA-12.
I’m going to presum your talking about the full auto shotgun and not the Vympel R-77 air to air missile system? 😉
I haven’t looked through all 138 comments, but did anyone bring up what I would consider the only real advantage to this firearm?
You don’t have to shoot it – it’ll scare ’em to death.
LOL!!!!’ And if that dosnt do the trick you might beat them to death with it!
PAGE 10!!!!! LMAO!!
Haven’t read the comments for a couple of days and I think there was only six (6) pages then.
I’d like to sum up what I’m seeing…
Hmmmmmmmmmmm?!
From my POV it seems just a … little … bit silly.
If you like it, buy it, but don’t bitch about the cost while you’re handing over the money! Don’t be such a child to throw a word tantrum because everything isn’t at your finger tips. If it’s not your cup of tea for whatever reason just say so; don’t cut on those who think it’s “cool,” they are entitled to their opinion, too.
For those who are somewhere in between with an opinion on concept, design, function, use, application and do forth don’t be discouraged, many are interested in what you have to say.
And … About this spelling that seems to have upset several and took up space for little or no reason on these pages. Enough already. I don’t care if it’s misspelled if I can understand what the author is trying to impart. I have personally given up on trying to make “spell check” or “Auto Correct” work. Even when I proof read and correct before posting I still find that these programs will put in what they choose regardless of my efforts. I agree that being able to spell is important, but I am also willing to cut some slack if I understand an authors intent and don’t need to nit pick their issues concerning grammar and spelling.
Haveing said all that I would like to thank those who took or take it upon themselves to fill the empty spaces with such amusing clutter in their quest to be precived as superior or in some way above the “common” folk. Point of fact: At the point that the SHTF or a like scenerio befalls us we are all going to be “common” folk. Might want to start working with that concept now while you can and get a bit more used to the idea.
Anyway, just wanted to thank everyone for yet another week of mostly enjoyable and informative reading. It seems that some of the least likely blogs garner the largest amount of comments. Who would have thunk it?
No, I would not buy a DP-12. I will explain why. When I hunt turkey, I use a Stevens double-barrel 12-gage shotgun. For home defense, I have a Mossberg 500 12 gage. When hunting, I know I have two shots….the forward trigger and the rear trigger. With the Mossberg, I know that one pump=one round. With the DP-12, I could see someone losing track of when they need to pull the trigger and when they need to pump again….. especially in a high-stress situation. Just my opinion.
When will they be available ? how soon can I purchase one? I am ready right now to purchase.
When the price hits a more reasonable $599-$649 range….then I’ll put it on my ‘must-have-this’ list. Until then, they can choke on their $1k price tag.
I have a Remington 870 bull pup acquired for $600-$700…totally reliable, and fun. Is another barrel and 7 more rounds worth another $300 -$400? I sincerely doubt it. Come down on the price and it may be worthwhile.
I will stick with my 870 that I have shot for over 25 years. It may only hold 7, but it is a part of me. Don’t fix it if it ain’t broke!
I’D HOPE THE PRICE FOR AFTER A YR. OR SO. BY THEN THE COMPETITION WILL DRIVE THE PRICE DOWN.
i want one !!!!!
Probably not for me . I’m betting that it’s a heavy gun with two barrels and two tubes full .
What is taking so long with it’s release? Hope it’s figuring out all the issues. Please release it soon. I want to buy one ASAP. This design is brilliant. Who can I throw my hard earned money that I’ve been saving too?
If it performs as advertised it would be a gun worth having .
DP-12 looks great. I want the gun for self defense and in my truck as a back up to my pistol. The price is way to much. I think that 800 USD is a better price. 1000 for a shot gun that is not a hunting or competition gun is a lot, just my opinion. Can’t wait for it to come out.
I dont really live the life where I would likely need have that much self defense handy, I just do not see as a viable option for me. I prefer the tried and tested pistol, shotgun, rifle. I just do not see this new weapon as trustworthy.
It’s a totally cool machine. You could hunt aliens with it. If it didn’t scare a burgler, they probably couldn’t BE scared.
Too pricey. Innovative for sure. Hopefully the price will come down after a year or so.
@ Eric.
Only if the Parent Company of The Shooter’s Log is reading all the comment made on this website “See the Light At the End of the Tunnel” and cut their losses, and Give In…
love the idea and sounds like a quality item, but a high price point for a fun oddity will slow sales. would buy one if priced right. never enough toys!!
Semper Fi and keep them loaded !!
Great idea, and I’m sure it’s a well manufactured tool.. But when I can buy 3) 12-ga. Pumps for the price of this, I’ll pass.
If it sold for $650.00, I’d be paying much closer attention, and reaching for. my credit card.
@ Curtis H.
The problem is if they had made this shotgun out of 6061-T6 Grade Aluminum, instead of 7075-T6 Grade Aluminum. The price would be probably around ~$800.00 USD. instead of $1,000.00 USD. Its like comparing Silver with Gold.
Looks interesting. I like the concept. Would buy one if it in fact works as advertises. A gun that doesn’t function properly is just a club that pisses off everyone when goes click instead of bang!
I would buy one based on what was said and its quality again based on the article. I drive e dune buggy, and can see application there the gun being small and shotgun is my protection weapon of choice at home and in the dunes. Also carry other things just like the shotgun since my wife may also be using for protection. We like MossBerg 500
Would make an excellent LE entry and close quarters weapon. Will purchase when available!
On a side note, has anyone heard from Martin Pierce lately. I hope nothing bad has happened to him.
How much?!?!?!?!
@ Lucas.
Well. THAT’S THE $64,000-Dollar Question, only time will tell and CTD stops it SHENANIGANS and TELLS US…
Like the rest of you, or maybe just some of you, I’m retired and a fixed income pensioner with the added distraction of being disabled. Having to “Penny Pinch” just to survive, This shotgun is a “Luxury” at its current price. And I can’t afford, most “Luxuries” that come alone. And this gun is that, unfortunately…
when is this going to be available? and what’s the cost
ime in how much?
Shut up and take my money!
I’d would consider buying this. Only if it’s price isn’t more than the Kel-Tec KSG (which it probably will be)
Don’t have an extra $1k to throw at a tech demonstration, my Supernova Tactical fits it’s purpose just fine.
Nice – can’t wait to see the price tag and video review as that will ultimately decide whether or not I buy. Looked at getting the KSG some months ago, but after holding one at gun shop, knew I wouldn’t be happy with it for pretty much same reasons as Mr. Bane, so I decided not to buy and got a new Molot VEPR-12 with folding stock instead, which for a semi-auo, is an awesome shotgun and really glad I got it instead of the KSG. Far from being a Bullpup obviously, but for the $ I think I got a much better gun. Still like the looks of Bullpup shotguns however, just want one that will perform and justify the price; the DP-12 appears to have that potential – we can only hope.
BO – take a chill pill dude, you’ll feel much better.
Sounds good. I will buy one. I will test it. If i can depend on it then it will be my bedroom and car weapon.
I also had considered KSG product but was dismayed by the poor workmanship and obvious flaws revealed by other reviewers. This is worth a serious look and I would purchase but in the 700-800 dollar range
I’ve read/watched such poor reviews of the Kel-Tec KSG and the Turkish UTS-15 that this doesn’t excite me at all, especially at a $1000+ MSRP. I’d be game for no more than $650.
“That’s why dangerous-game hunters use double rifles.” Most dangerous game double-rifle’s I’ve seen have double triggers, not single triggers. Unless the trigger is mechanical and not inertia, double triggers make the most sense on a double rifle used for DG. BTW – Does one get a mall ninja tee shirt with their purchase of the DP-12 along with a patch for your web gear that says “Official Operator?”
no way i”m retired and not rich. I was a workin man
Yes, I might buy this if the price is right. I would like to see a video of this gun in action.
I would love to have one if I could afford it!
Absolutely!! I had been planning on a Kel-Tec KSG but after seeing this and the review on it I am in on this weapon!
I would buy one, but I want the option to fire both barrels. Either that or I’d take it apart and figure out how to make it drop both hammers.
Looks very interesting but for that price I’ll stick with my Mossberg 500’s stashed around the house.
I’d like to see it in 410.
i own a ksg…
best shotgun in my book.
this design looks like a direct rip from the ksg…
the design looks redundant in my book.
im sticking with my ksg
I’d love to own one. I think it’d be extra comfort in the HOME, and loads of fun at the RANGE. Criminals: I would sure hate to be on the business end of this puppy!!!
If the workmanship is outstanding price may be justified, although it still may be a stretch for us working people in todays economy. Thanks for the article.
Yes for a dime I would buy this gun all day long!!!
I bought both the KSG and UTS. I still own the UTS. I have it loaded with 24 rounds of Aguila “short” ammo (buck on the left, slugs on the right)
For home or auto, I would do the same with this gun.
If money is your primary issue, buy 4x 870s and put them wherever you think is best. I have those, as well.
If you think you need plywood and double sheet rock in your home, you need to spend more time training with your family in a safe environment.
I’m not rich or brilliant. I just know my priorities.
I hope the “rack of the slide” dissuades intruders, but I rather have 24 “short” shells, instead of 15 “magnums”, when defending my home and family.
Yes, I want one. I have been looking at the KSG, but I want this for the house!
Email me when they are ready to order!
Can’t… resist… Must… have… $475…
If it comes in under $1000 and looks, fits, and feels like quality workmanship, then YES, I’d buy one as quickly as I could. It would find residence in the bedroom on hall closet loaded with a bunch of #2 and #4’s and be my number one home defense piece. Probably get a strobe flashlight and green laser mounted on it as well. I’d feel pretty safe under most circumstances LOL. Is it “required”? Heck no, but it’d be darned effective and have a hell of a coolness factor for this 62 year old phat phart….
How long are the barrels? I had an old notion that a shotgun had to have a 17 inch minimum barrel to outlaw sawed off shotguns? The barrels do not look 17 inch. What is the law on sawed off shotguns?
Pretty good gun to have if we were invaded by ISUS but many of us already have AR’s etc. .
@Scott,
If I remember correctly to be of legal over the counter sale a shotgun must have a the least an 18″ barrel(s) and be a minimum total of 29″ overall.
The only production gun that I ever had that fit that description was an IRA “Brute” 18 1/8″ Dbl Barrels 29 1/8″ overall made in Brazil. What made it truly formidable was that it was a 10ga. You had to hang on to it when fired or it would bit you. I had all brass shells for it, they make a very satisfying sound when dropped into the chamber, had a box of Punkin Balls 1 3/4 oz and a box of #1 Buck (22 to 24, .30caliber pellets per shell I think). The business end looked like the openings to the Holland Tunnels. Wish I still had it today, it was a conversation stopper and what it could manage to do to a solid core door from 10 to 12 feet away was just short of amazing. Anyway, Scott, I’m pretty sure those are the minunum numbers one has to have over the counter. Anything of smaller dimensions and one enters the land of Class III, and tax stamps, and long waits and so forth.
I may be incorrect as to the aver all leanth requirement. It may be a 28″ minunum instead of 29″ hope that dosn’t confuse things . . .
Boy this even a record for me, three comments REDDIT’D in one day, on one website. That only usually happen on multiple websites. Keep up your diligent work The Shooter’s Log/CTD, make us proud of hiding information and providing misinformation to your loyal customers.
I’d buy one for home defense if reasonably priced.
Question…
In the article Michael Bane states that it would make a good “Bedroom Gun”,
Loaded with self defense rounds in one tube and slugs in the other tube.
The gun as described fires one tube and then the other and then it is pumped to re-chamber two rounds. There seems to be no way to select which ammo type to use for a given target / scenario. Might not want to dump slugs down the hall toward the kitchen !
No slugs in the kitchen??? Ya think!
One of things I like about the UTAS & KSG systems is that you can switch between loads & fire several of one kind if need be. Say you need a couple of slugs & then switch to buckshot, you fire a couple of rounds out of one tube & then switch to the other, pretty simple.
As I understand this article, with the DP-12 you essentially have a double barreled shotgun with a 14 round tube & you’re committed to what is loaded. That is, unless you want to work with a sidesaddle or bandoleer in which case, save a few dollars and just get a 870 bullpup kit or a Mossy.
I definitely would buy this gun if the price was right. I held the prototype at the 2014 NRA show. It had good ergonomics. The disappointing thing is the talk of the $1K price tag. That is way too expensive. No manual shotgun should be more expensive than a Benelli semi auto. People will wait a couple of years for the novelty to wear off hoping it will drop $500 or so. In the meantime the company will go out of business. Don’t get greedy and ask too much on a initial offering of an unproven design. If it is a quality gun, word will spread. I’d pay a price equivalent to two 870s (2x$270=$540) maximum.
Has defintely piqued my interest. Specs sound good but would really like to know about maintenance and upkeep. Is it easy to field strip? Any special requirements/considerations? Is it modular like an AR so components can be changed out? Price is a bit high – but could be worth it depending upon modularity, ease of maintenance, etc.
Yet another curio to be relegated to the dustbin of historical guns with no real purpose in life.
To BIG VOIGTS
Sir, everybody makes mistakes. And you are right. But even comments should be proofread. That’s piqued not peaked. Too entirely different words.
Yes I would be very interested in buying this shotgun for home defense. The price doesn’t seem to be that high for a quality weapon.
Interesting, but would like to know about noise level with muzzle and receiver so much closer to ears. And the price is more than I would be spending on a home defense shotgun, even with advantages. Maybe if I were police or military and clearing urban dwellings…
@ Brooks A. Mick.
Noise level is determined by rate of fire, in the case of a 12-gauge shotgun with normal or 468-grain weight, is LOW end scale of 154.6dB and HIGH end scale of 162.7dB.
Hey Brooks,
Understand your reservations.
I haven’t noticed any increase or precived change in sound levels with my bull piped 870 so I would expect the same from this Double Pump. I have shot my 870BP. side by side with both an unmodified 500 and 870 shooting the same munitions both inside and outside.
I only brought the stock mod up cause so many out there already have either a 500 or 870 in their collection. Instead of spending $800 to a grand or more on a new platform one can mod what the have for $300 to $350. If they like that then they may consider the greater outlay of cash for something new.
Just think one should be aware of the options that are out there.
My three primaries are all Bullpups (SOCOM in a Jugganaute, MSAR STG556 with mag mod., and the 870) they all fit into one Pellican case with their optics and associated hardware. It’s made it easer to travel.
If all one is looking for is a home defense shotgun then this may not be something you need. If space is critical or this will be a “vehicle” platform it’s worth the consideration or as you say for either military or LE. Decreasing it’s leanth with out loosing any of its potential certainly opens up positions in a breaching stack that are not normally avaliable to a standard Tac shotgun. My concern would be the weight and bulk of this Double Pump more than anything else.
A lot of people are under the misconception that a short (18″) tactical barrel has poor longer range ability. That one needs a rifled barrel for accurate distance. This is simply not so. There are rounds the work better in a rifled barrel, they were designed to do so. It’s all about the ammunition one uses. A smooth bore with the right munition is extreamly accurate and effective within the 150 meter envelope. Some will argue this statement but real wordl expierance says different. Chech out DDuplek they know their stuff. They make a fragable interior residence protection that is very effective on soft targets but won’t penatrate 2 layers of drywall. Need to stop a car?, they got something for that too. Again, something to consider and look into if your depending on a shotgun.
@ Brooks A. Mick.
If you want to add an extra-layer of protection, add a sheet of Plywood behind the Two-Layered Drywall.
PS. In Stephen King’s novel “The Shawshank Redemption”. Brooks is/was Irish. I didn’t know that. Was it mentioned in the book.
This would make a great home defence piece.
@Secundius,
From my experience two layers of 3/4″ plywood topped with two layers of 5/8″ Sheetrock will not stop a Slug/Sabot, 00 or #1 Buck, or Buck an Ball within the close engagement envelope of walled buildings. A stud may slow it down enough but that can’t be counted on. Even a magnum load of #8 birdshot within the confined engagement ranges of a residence or like structure will penetrate and still cause collateral damage.
The only round that I’ve found that will not do this are those that are designed to fragment and for use in this kind of high risk environment. These frangible rounds will expend 100% of their energy into a soft targets but not penetrate a wall. As with all things there are pros and cons to this. As most people who perpetrate home invasions and/or robberies don’t wear a vest or armor plate the work very well.
Agree way overpriced and is deff more for a dangerous game such as brown bears with slugs or an urban combat shotgun ,you would not be hunting deer at ranges that we do here in ohio with those short barrels it is a strictly hi dollar military or law enforcement game warden ,african guide type firearm than practical home defense in a hone defense shotgun even a single barrel pump takes 1 round of 00 buck to quell any and all problems you will encounter in the home most always and the flash and noise level would be outrageous in a home defense shotgun ,just not a practical civilian firearm to me in any way .
@ 1 With a Bullet.
I posted an answer to your question at 11:52 am EST. ~2-Hours and 40-Minutes later, the Fo-Police of The Shooter’s Log/CTD. REDDIT my comments, not surprising really. I’m just surprised it took them so long.
Go to Downrange.com, and get the “skinny” on the DP12…
I’m used to shooting trap with over-unders. Interested in a bullpup with 870-type action to reload the next two shells. I’d like to know when they are available!
@ Pete in Florida.
No set date, most likely when and/or after MSRP. is finalized.
I’d be extremely interested in getting one of these but the price would have to come way down. I’m thinking this would be one of the best home protection weapons I’ve ever seen. Tubes loaded and chamber empty, just pump and go. I don’t see anyone getting to you.
Dave L its peaked my interest and Punisher this is how you spell RARELY and did you spell WHICH wrong on purpose due to Halloween WITCH? Proofread so you guys don’t look uneducated.
Gee, Big, “piqued” is the word you were looking for. “Peaked” is defined as being pale and wan or emaciated.
Watch those corrections, they can bite you in the butt and make you feel downright peaked.
Dentist’s Remorse?
Other than find out that the DP-12 Shotgun is made of Billeted 7075-grade Aluminium, trying to get information for the CTD website. Is like a dentist trying pull teeth from a 3-year old. I don’t know why I even bother.
Especially like the Bullpup Unlimited website. Several designs and calibers I’d be interested in. Its like a HALO Candy Store. Want to try each new flavor, till my teeth rot…
PS. Don’t forget to REDDIT, this one too.
Hell ‘ya! I’d love to give it a run around the black! Not saying i’d buy it hands down, But I’d sure consider it and would love to take a closer look at it.
OK, sorry for the misspelled words. Spell check didn’t catch them, and it’s late, I need to go to bed.
Looks like it will be a big hit with the mall comando crowd oops now I guess I have to look forward to all the super expert double naught ninja warrior retorts lol back on duty in 10 see ya
WOW!! What a “shotgun” pattern of comments and were already on page 3!!!
For those who don’t have the funds for such a platform or are looking for a more … moderate…but viable change or upgrade may I offer this option.
If you are currently the owner of an 870 or 500 …. Or perhaps you just saw one at your local pawn and think it’s time to add to your B.O.B.
Well then, . . . .consider making it one of the finest, well balanced, large bore, CQC/ Protection/ Hunting platforms you might ever have occasion to own. At least it is from my POV.
Take a look at a company called Bullpups Unlimited. This is a USA company home based in Tennessee. The make a drop in, no machining, 20 minute conversion time bull pup stock kit for the 870 and 500. It moves the CoG back towards the shoulder about 11 inches causing a better balance and ergonomics. It will take the standard 18″ 870 and make it shorter than the average AR CAR. I’ve taken mine and run it thru the wringer and I haven’t got a complaint yet.
I only mention it cause so many here seem to like the idea of this DB. Pump Gun. well it’s a Bullpup in its own right. If you don’t think your going to have $1000 or more dollars to acquire this unique but practical double barrel BUT have a few hundred to upgrade your existing hardware then give Bullpups Unlimited a contact. Ask or address your email to JJ he runs the shop there and will be pleased to respond.
This is a solid design, well made, and will stand up to hard use. Its NOT a toy! It’s a solid upgrade for two already solid and proven platforms. Don’t take my word for it. Give then a shout and see for yourself. Google it, there’s pictures and some good descriptions. Some of you may see the value and worth of this configuration. I’ve had the opportunity recently to have had it with me overseas. One of the greater attributes of this Bullpup pump gun is how well it works from the inside of a vehicle. It’s size makes it easy to maneuver from a concealed it’s bore makes it a surprise for those on its bigness end.
Anyway, if your interested take a look.
I would want one, but $1000 is way too high for my budget for something unproven.
@ CTD.
In other words, you plan to REDDIT, IT AGAIN…
Looks like a good competitor to the Kel Tec and UTS both of which I’ve been interested in. My Mossberg 930 could use some company. These short high cap shotguns are the way to go for home defense and when you have to shoot two blast into the air to scare the bad guy away you only have to pump pull pull instead of pump pull pump pull. Lol
@Daven
If you have a 500 or 870 then check out Bullpups Unlimited. Just Google it. You may find an alternative that suits you. I certainly did.
this is a winner it gets around the reload issues with my coach gun and can be better utilized in close quarters can’t wait to get hands on for a trial
I like it from what i see here. Price point of not over $1K is a buy for me if its reviews by testers from gun sites and mags. A 20 gauge would really be the best for home defense I think.
@ OPFOR6.
Super Shorty 20-Gauge available at Serbu Firearms of Tampa, FL. Remington 870-based 2+1 configuration, $705.00 USD. Holster available for additional $145.00 USD. @ (http://.www.serbu.com). Saw it earlier today. Saw your comment, giving you information. Thought you might be interested…
Yes I would be a buyer. I have watched these shot guns. This one looks like the one for me. I like a proven system the two side by side in pump action. Cant go wrong.
Why is there no info on the CTD website for the DP-12? I want one! and will put down a deposit right now for it!
Would I need a special federal license to buy this shotgun?
No . . . . Not yet at least. I’m sure that Kaliforna and New Gorky and maybe one or two others might find a way for it to be illegal. But not the Fed’s . . . At least not yet……
TO MUCH / TO GODDY / TO HEAVY / TO HIGH PRICED…I DON’T SEE IT AS A PRACTICAL NOR USEFUL WEAPON FOR MUCH OF ANYTHING EXCEPT SHOWING OFF & I CAN DO MUCH BETTER & CHEEPER THAN THIS…( NOT MY STYLE ) BUT, GOOD LUCK TO THOSE WHO HAVE THE RIGHT & FREEDOM TO INJOY SUCH A WEAPON !!
If you’re illiterate, don’t use all caps. *too. *cheaper. *enjoy.
Missed one – *gaudy.
I’ll wait for it to shake out a little but I may have to own one of these. From this review, it seems more reliable than what’s offered right now.
Will it chamber 3″ or 3 1/2″ or will it be 2 3/4″ only? Will there be the ability to go with longer barrels than an 18″?
If you could use 3 1/2 with 26″ barrels, this would be a beast hunting.
But at over $1k without those options, They can keep it in the warehouse
For a kilobuck? Nope. First time you use it for real, the cops take it and you will never see it again. Give me something rugged and dependable that you can afford to lose. I’d be reluctant to use this gun. I have an Ithaca Deerslayer that I keep at home, take it camping, etc. Eight rounds, bottom eject, never fails, not so expensive I don’t dare shoot somebody, and I can lean it up against a tree and not worry. Like the reviewed gun, but way, way too much money. Really need 15 rounds of 12 gauge? You should drink in some other bar!
Sir C.H,
You really need Square up on a target or multiple targets and rip through 15 rounds to fully comprehend the benefits.
Until then enjoy the swill wherever you are watering down at.
Its sic!
yesi want go buy.
Yoj fools thatleft remarks about the trigger, obviously did not read the product description, as ita answers most of your questions.
Imagine this shoty as an SBS! Weeeeeoouuuuu!!!
This would definitely be something I would be interested in. Unfortunately since they don’t list a possible price point other than “Over $1,000” how far over that point would be a concern to me.
Seems like a lot of gun if priced around $1K. Price will determine it’s success. It has caught my eye as a dedicated home defense weapon. Wonder how long the barrels are and patterning? Next would be its weight?
Shut up and take my money!!!!
Piece of junk remmington versa max
Tactical semi auto
Is the only shotgun you will ever need
So, Randy ….. You know this how . . . exactly?
I would consider it if is comes in under a grand.
This is definitely a shotgun I would buy!! As long as the price is not set over the clouds, this seems to be a great defensive weapon! I think the guys who are making it have the right idea & maybe there could be some work done to improve it but that is what R & D is made to do!! I am sure all the kinks will be worked out before it hits the market!
@ Joseph Barber.
My only concern is, being double-barreled, Inf adding a “Breaching Barrel Extensions” too one of the barrels, effects the performance and ballistics of the other barrel.
Being priced, minimally at a $1,000.00 USD. is being set, as interest in the shotgun increases. I suspect the price is going to be around $1,800.00 USD.
A shotgun is only a shotgun
I love em but my bulldog painted pretty mossberg is gonna do the same damage and didnt cost a grand.
Oh come on! That’s pure speculation. Part of the article mentions not liking the price point of the SRM, so why would they then raise their price after saying theirs will land at about $1k? That would drive off business. I like the idea of something unique (that works) and will save up for a little longer if need be in order to get one.
@ 1 With a Bullet.
To answer your question, I had to go OFF The Shooter’s Log Website to get answers. As most the people in this forum have noticed, when going to the CTD Website to ask about the product. That there NOT going to get anything, and that they’ll be DELIBERATELY vague about answering your inquiries and redirect you in ANOTHER direction.
The website I had to go too, answered most of my questions, but not all of them. First, an foremost, the minimum price amout of $1,000.00 USD. can be found at the bottom of the page. Second, because the DP-12 Shotgun is made of Billeted 7075-Grade Alumunum, its going to be expensive. And that’s why the MINIMUM PRICE is set at $1,000.00 USD. Third, you interest in the product and its availability is going to drive up the MSRP. And as Pete in Alaska mentioned about this FORUM going VIRILE, because as he put it as being on page three and still chugging along. Because of products INTEREST. I’m supplying you the website address, so you can see for yourselves. But you’d better be fast, because I think there going to REDDIT my comments, in a hurry. (http://www.downrange.tv/blog/first-look-the-dp-12-double…shotgun/31865)
I agree with everyone on this page about pricing. Just because you (could) charge an arm and a leg doesn’t mean that you should.
I HAVE AN AK BULPUP. IT WAS A KIT AND ITS R922 COMPLIANT THE ONLY THING I DON’T LIKE , IS THE BOLT IS RIGHT BY YOUR CHEEK AND IT’S VERY RAERLY HIT’S ME IN THE HEAD WITH A SPENT ROUND. WITH THE DOUBLE BARREL HOLDING A TOTAL OF 14 ROUNDS. IT WOULD NOT BE LEGAL WHERE THERE IS A MAG CAPACITY BAN. CALIFORNIA WOULD BE BANNED, NYC AND OTHER STATES THAT DONT ALLOW MORE THAN 10 ROUNDS IN A FIREARM THE PRICE TAG WILL BE AROUND A $1K. RATHER OWN A SAIGA 12 WITH THE 10 ROUND DRUM IN SA. AT MORE THAN HALF THE PRICE..
Im sure you could get tube plugs to limit it to 5 rounds each
Is there an option for double barrel shots? I noticed it wasn’t mentioned, so I’m thinking not. I know I wouldn’t use it much, if at all, but having the option to would be a bonus. I’m thinking in a home defense situation, if one guy is lucky enough to get past you and/or shoot your dog or say something bad about your Momma, it’d be extra satisfying to be able to hit him with both barrels.
The way I read the article it will be a single trigger with 2 stage pull.
A few questions: What is the loading procedure? Can only one tube be loaded (either side) and does the gun recognize this and require only one pull of the trigger? Just thinking of what happens after I shot my load and still got problems around me.
Will see how it goes. Been wanting a UTC but price is a factor. Bullpups are cool but if you could keep it under a grand (and you’d still make money)people would buy the hell out of them once they’re proven reliable.
What happens if you just shoot one barrel then try to pump it? Do you still have to push a slide release and will it eject both the empty and loaded shell?
I already own a keltec KSG. To be honest, almost every negative issue that has been mentioned in the popular press about the KSG has been just hype. Most can easily be traced back to user error or failure to simply read and follow the manual. That said I would welcome the new DP-12 to my collection. I hope they take a little time to set the DB-12 up so it will feed and shoot the 1 3/4″ 12 guage shells. My KSG feeds these short but plenty powerful shells with 100% reliability giving me a 24 round bullpup shotgun for home defense. If the DB-12 can do the same, I will be giving one a home.
I bought the KSG 3 months ago. It loaded 3 shells out of 100 pumps. Sent it back to Kel-Tec and two months later got it back. It chambered when I pumped it, but I have not had a chance to take it to task at the range. The sad thing is. It is a second gen. The feeding problem was supposed to have been taken care of for this generation.
Is it a rotating trigger? I don’t see two 1triggers, or does it shoot both barrels at once? not very desirable that!
@ Desert.
Probably a Selector Controlled Triggering system…
IT’S A SINGLE / SELECT TRIGER…IT PULLS ONE BARREL AT A TIME…LEFT TO RIGHT…PULL RELEASE / PULL RELEASE OR FLIP SWITCH TO PULL BOTH BARRELS AT OUNCE…IT’S LIKE ANOTHER MODEL WITH SIMULAR TRATES & LOOKS.
DESERT! IT HAS A ROTATING TRIGGER.. WITCH BARREL FIRES FIRST THEY DID NOT SAY. OK BRO?
Left then right it said it I think in the first 2 paragraphs
Do you guys not read first pull right barrel second pull left whats so hard about that. Spend more time understanding what you are reading then in the comments section.
I agree with Michael Bane, “one heck of a bedroom gun”, and a car gun. Heck, buy one for every bedroom and car.
I recently purchased a Gen 3 UTAS UTS 15 with the laser/light combo. To date I have put just over 300 rounds down the barrel with not a single issue. The firearm feeds well and I make sure to clean and lubricate the gun after each range session. I too had my reservations as the first two generations had their share of issues. I am very pleased with the UTAS’s abity to deliver 15 rounds at the target and quickly reload from the top of the gun.
I did however have a problem with the laser/light add on as the ‘laser only’ function of the unit failed after 80 rounds or so. I am hoping to have it back soon and fixed from UTAS.
I hope that this info is helpful to you in making your decision wether or not to purchase this weapon.
I would def be interested in owning one of these based on what i read.
I would consider the DP-12 after more reviews and price consideration.
Like the UTS and the KSG, I’ll watch it in the marketplace and follow reviews of it until I’m satisfied that it is, indeed, a 2GEN piece and not just another new idea that has “hit and miss problems.” Still, doesn’t look too bad to me.
The engineering looks solid, and the design is good. I like the BullPup latout as I like all things BullPup. 14 rounds in the tubs with two in battery along with everything else that makes it work will make for a heavy weapon but well balanced in the BP configuration.
My mind wanders to some of the speciality munitions now available for the 12ga. Anything made by DDuplek and the 12ga grenades in both HE and Anti Personal. First round HE second round AntPer , 14 rounds of #1 buck and ball and DDuplek Hexolite. I’m thinking that would be quite the load out for urban asymmetrical warfair. I’m betting that you need to be young and pump iron to carry one of theses for any leanth of time. They always give the big guys in the squad the belt fed I’m thinking that this would be next on the list as a heavy weight.
I’ll wait for pricing and availibility to come out and give them some production time before thinking about acquiring one. Nice write up and a good read! Thanks for the insight.
PETE. I’M 5FT8″ AND I WAS A SMALL GUY IN VIETNAM. I WAS AN ARMY RANGER,RECON. I TOTED AN M60 ON MY SHOULDER. YOU TALK ABOUT A HEAVY WEAPON. YET I WAS STRONG ENOUGH TO HANDEL IT. I’M 64 AND DON’T KNOW IF I COULD CARRY ONE AROUND FOR A CERTAIN PERIOD OF TIME LET ALONE SHOOT IT WITH ACCUARCY. GETTING OLD SUCKS,LOL.
@Punisher
I feel your pain, I mean I REALLY feel you pain! I’m 62 and I’m still running around like I’m 30 but it’s getting harder with each passing year. Still skiing 40 days or more in the winter and my work takes me around the world so I’m still living out of a back pack and a gun case most places I go. My new mantra is “Alive is your friend, Alive is your friend!”
Let’s just say it has certainly piqued my interest, but with no price listed I am not going out to search for one any time soon. I also don’t need to be the first one on my block to have one, nor have the first production ones. I want a refined, affordable version.
@ Dave L.
Did a little digging, CTD is to be distributor of DP-12 Shotgun. No set price yet, but, suppose to be in excess of One-Grand, USD.
I’m excited about this new design shotgun and, think the MSRP will remain a bit higher – as long as there is a single source supplier.
Right on target. I agree, 100%