General

Why Tell the Truth When the Lie Is so Much More Convenient?

One More time, Mrs. Clinton, the Gun Industry is not ‘Immune from Liability.’ I mean come on, Even Bernie Sanders knows that and had to call Clinton’s statement into question adding, that he does not favor trying to put firearms manufacturers out of business. That is not to say the Democratic/Socialist Senator from Vermont is pro Second Amendment—as most of us would agree.

Clinton-Debate This is not a new attack from Clinton or other pro gun control politicians. They often rely on individuals—often categorized as low information voters—with a ‘stunted’ propensity for vetting details or claims. Although the media or other individuals from various think tanks or industry groups can refute the claims after the fact, the damage is done and the correct information seldom reaches the majority of the voting audience. That’s where you and I can be proactive.

For instance, after Clinton falsely claimed the gun industry is immune from liability, Victor E. Schwartz refuted the claim in an article in the Wall Street Journal. You can click here to read the article, which is important, but more importantly you can help spread the word through social media by either sharing this article or the original from the WSJ.

Another great resource worth spreading was when Larry Keane of the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF) refuted Hillary’s earlier attempt to make this false claim last fall.

The main point is we can create or support our own grass roots effort to correct the record, disseminate the true information and support and defend our Second Amendment freedoms. However, we have to all pull in the same direction.

What have you done, or will you be doing, to Support the Second Amendment? Share your experiences and ideas in the comment section.

The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt!'s blog, The Shooter's Log, is to provide information—not opinions—to our customers and the shooting community. We want you, our readers, to be able to make informed decisions. The information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper Than Dirt!

Comments (38)

  1. Generally speaking… the anti-gun people do not lie. They us a little thing which the communists used. It’s called “propaganda”. That is, the truth is “slightly” bent and twisted to support their cause. Just like when they quote the CDC and FBI data, and combine figures from criminal assaults, accidental shootings, suicides, and justified shootings (ie. police, self defense, etc).

    This is not to say they never lie. When they claim a specific weapon, like an AR was used when it remained in the trunk of the car, or identify an AR as a military assault weapon.

    It worked in the USSR and other tyrannical states, why not here? Sadly, we all thought we were smarter than our enemies, but they were actually among us.

  2. They use Hillary’s picture in hospital emergency rooms when a guy comes in with an erection he’s had for more than four hours. One look at Hillary, and TA-DAH, flaccid in less than two seconds!

  3. While I can still legally buy a weapon, with Federal Permission, I have seen quite a few persons I have known as standup honorable men, suddenly lose their ability to purchace or own a weapon.
    FEDS and State bureaucrats love to hide behind procedures, they pretend concern for the damaged civil rights because they have all the crossed’s and dtted i’s in their own world.
    I take note how some say “Well maybe you forgot pr did not know of an incidence in your past”, now thrre is your bureaucrat you must be guilty if they say so.
    I do not fight the anti gun crowd, I donate to gov approved causes mostly by annonymous means, and I try to dtay for all appearances as a true blue flag waving Fedetalist Patriot(sarc).
    Not being one of my country right or wrongs I will criticize Federalist actions and I feel all of us who apply for permission to buy own or carty a weapon are “Federalist”, and so I try to not stray outside the Federalist die hards borders, gor the bureaucrats pens are far more fn dangerous to freedom than any foreign enemies.
    So I will shed crocodile tears for ones who through some bureaucrats pen loses his
    weapons and automaticly becomes a criminal, even after a lifetime of legal carry and federalist ass kissing I know that I too can lose my
    priveleges at any time and guess what, the bureaucrats do not have to explain why.
    Of course they want you to come begging and crying to them for aid, but while they survive as
    employees it is by siding their office not the people.
    If those who become criminals turn in your guns, do not worry cuz come the word surrender mine will freely join them
    weap
    .

  4. For the gun hating progressive liberals, failure is not an option, it’s a way of life! After all, when they can’t come up with facts, any old tired lie will do.

    1. Dan, they wouldn’t know the truth if it bit them in the ass. They prefer to make up lies that fit their needs, instead of finding and using facts. Remember, you can’t spell “Liberal” without L-I-E.

  5. Went to gun shop purchased semiauto NICS approved. Went to same gun shop following week to purchase shotgun NICS denied. Submitted appeal received form letter 1 month later. Appears FBI is doing its own gun control for the dems. Same FBI that drags it feet investigating Hillary. I’m retired military,hold a current concealed carry permit, submitted SSAN yet someone with all those same creds got in trouble and I was denied. GO FIGURE

    1. @LAZYBONES:

      Your story really shocked me. I didn’t know this kind of thing could happen. I thought that only a major event like an arrest or conviction that is detected by federal computers can cause your status to change.

      Maybe G-Man can comment on this 1 week approved/next week denied scenario.

    2. ss1,

      I am not positive, but I believe once the waiting period has passed without a denial from NICS, the firearm can be released. If I am correct (I can’t remember where I got that from, so someone else can feel free to back me up or correct me) that could explain why he was denied a week later. The paperwork may have simply caught up. Otherwise, it was just a timing issue. ~Dave Dolbee

    3. @Dave Dolbee:

      Thanks for your input, but I’m not sure if that explains why he was approved on a “semiauto” in week 1, and then denied on a shotgun in week 2.

    4. @ LAZYBONES, ss1, and Dave Dolbee,

      Ss1, I caught your post and am responding to all concerned…

      Dave, you are correct. However, it is not really what we call a waiting period, but it works out to about 5 days total and if no response is heard back from NICS, the FFL may proceed with the sale. However, I don’t believe that is how I am reading LAZYBONES ‘situation. What I’m reading is that on his first purchase of the semiauto the FFL got was is called a “Proceed” returned from NICS which allowed the firearm to be purchased immediately. Upon the attempted purchase of another firearm a week later the FFL got a “Denied” from NICS which flat out prohibits the sale and also is the federal government’s way of telling LAZYBONES they consider him to be a prohibited possessor. What you refer to is a ‘Delay which is not a “Proceed” or a “Denial”, but more or less somewhat in-between and requires further investigation by NICS. If they do not respond back with a “Proceed” or a “Denial” in 5 days, the FFL can sell you the firearm as if it were a “Proceed” status.

      LAZYBONES, going off of only what you’ve written, you have much bigger problems to worry about than just a standing “Denial”. Your NICS denial didn’t just stop you from that last purchase, but it also means you are currently a prohibited possessor of ANY firearm which includes not only that semiauto you had purchased a week before, but also any other firearm in your home or vehicle. The penalty is prison, and Obama has federal prosecutors pushing for the max 10 years on prohibited possessors right now. In addition, you are supposed to self-report to your State Authority and turn in you Concealed Weapons Permit or you may face State penalties as well.

      The last sentence of your post seems at odds with how the NICS appeals process works. Your appeals response letter should have done one of three things: 1) Cleared you, 2) Confirmed you to actually be a prohibited possessor, or 3) Requested additional information and the investigation will continue.

      With that said, based on how you wrote your post it appears the response letter has deemed you a prohibited possessor at the conclusion of their investigation and yet you’ve just accepted that and then stated to us that someone with all your identity information has committed unlawful acts in your name. I certainly hope you are planning to do more than just accept this.

      Ss1 is aware of my federal law enforcement background which is why he mentioned me. I’d need to know more about your particular “Denial” and the State in which it occurred to give any definitive feedback. Obviously you don’t live in a State that allows your Concealed Permit to bypass a NICS check.

      I can say that of the 2 types of transfer refusals (delay or denial), only a “Delay” appeal requires a fingerprint card be submitted with your appeals packet, whereas a fingerprint card on a “Denial” appeals packet is optional. However, it is highly recommended to submit the fingerprint card on any type of appeal because it can immediately establish you as not being the prohibited possessor which they confused you with on file to begin with.

      Did you submit a fingerprint card? If so, it would have positively cleared you. However, and not to get too nosey, but sometimes things get submitted into NICS from years past and just now hit the system; especially with Obama pushing States to update NICS. What this could mean is maybe some old event got put into NICS and you truly have no recollection it was even a qualifying event. Unfortunately that can happen to the best of people. Thus the right to bear arms shall not be infringed… but they do anyway.

    5. @G-Man:

      Thanks for taking the time to analyze this!!

      What I was worried about is the government suddenly deciding to deny based upon frequent buying activity, or the type of weapons a person buys. But from your explanation, it looks like this happened because of the delays in the process, and LAZYBONES has a much bigger problem on his hands.

    6. I have submitted a VAF appeal with fingerprints and hope to get a VAF pin. NICS is now working on appeals submitted in June 2015, so it will be a long time before I hear back from them. Thank you Gman for your response and you are correct it was for 2 separate firearms. Hopefully the appeal allows me to keep my semi auto pistol until it is resolved on the shotgun.

    7. @ LAZYBONES, (Good info and read for others in this post.)

      You become eligible to be a candidate for submitting an application requesting a VAF only after having successfully appealed your original “Denial” (or “Delay”) and subsequently received an appeals certificate that should accompany the formal letter stating your appeal has been overturned.

      So now when I read you’ve applied for a VAF, I must assume one of two things: Either you don’t understand how the NICS appeals process works in conjunction with the VAF program or you have been brief in the content of your posts and did actually receive a letter overturning your appeal.

      Though anyone at any time may submit a VAF application, its purpose is not to further appeal an initial request that was never overturned. However, if a person never submitted an initial appeals request, they can go straight for a VAF application which will serve as both an initial appeals request and upon overturn, will also serve as a VAF request as well.

      For others to better understand: The VAF is a way of asking the FBI to keep the results of a successful appeal on file indefinitely so that you don’t have to keep appealing future “Denials” or “Delays”. Otherwise, all records of every NICS check and any successful appeals are destroyed by law within 24 hours or 88 days (respectively) depending on the circumstances.

      Because of this law requiring all NICS records be destroyed, there is no future reference in any FBI systems showing that you’ve previously won an appeal, and thus the next time you try to purchase a gun, you have to go through the appeals all over again. Not only is this inconvenient for you, but a waste of tax dollars to pay to have NICS employees duplicate the same investigations over and over again on appeals that have already been previously won – (Thank the Brady Bill anti-gun libs for not thinking this one through).

      But it is up to you to take action before your records are allowed to be retained. Therefore, the VAF system was set up to allow citizens the right to override the NICS records destruction law and serves as a form of consent you grant the FBI telling them they have your explicit permission to keep such records permanently on file. This is revocable by you at any time in writing. You even get issued your own personal VAF number known as a VAF UPIN for future reference – (Aren’t the libs just grand).

      Back to LAZYBONES’ situation… Even though you did not use the VAF application process in the way it was intended, assuming you waited long enough for all your previous NICS check and appeals records to purge, it will appear to them (NICS) as if you’ve submitted an initial application for the first time – ever. And since you stated you added a fingerprint card this time around I hope the new appeals outcome will be in your favor.

      A final note to everyone else appealing a denial: Not to pick on LAZYBONES, but leaving out important information such as the fingerprint card the first time led to a second (unnecessary) investigation which costs all of us in tax dollars. But it does worse – it creates an unnecessary backlog and increasingly longer wait times for everyone else. Not only for those in Appeals, but ultimately it affects regular NICS checks as well given they are all done by the same employee base.

      But it is worse for those in Appeals because NICS management will shift workers priority to conduct active NICS checks over those waiting on an Appeal. Even this past January they had to stop all Appeals completely in order to support the mass influx of active NICS checks after Obama’s threat of more anti-gun Executive Action. This explains LAZYBONES’ long anticipated wait for a final answer.

  6. One of the most important thing we as gun owners can do is to lobby our senators to remember our constitutional rights when they are considering a new justice to replace justice Scalia! It is of vital importance that the new justice is “pro constitution”. Please contact your senators (www.senate.gov) and let them know you want a Supreme Court justice that will protect your constitutional rights!

    1. Michael says it best. We all need to be proactive in the process by pushing on our representatives to protect “ALL” of our constitutionally guaranteed rights. As for the uninformed voters, their efforts in finding the truth are very limited by their desire to know the truth.

      “The people who work for a living are severely outnumbered by the people who vote for a living.”

  7. Must be careful… The government was able to locate every suspect cow and calf, right down to the stalls they were in when Mad Cow was an issue. Before long, the anti-gunners will make us buy a cow with every firearm. Don’t forget to paint in BIG BOLD letters… COW on the side so the authorities will know which they are to shoot or taze, and which to safe for the BBQ afterward.

  8. The same dolts who say it is logistically impossible to ’round up’ 11 million illegal aliens believe it is possible to confiscate 360 million firearms and tens of billions of rounds if ammunition.

    Regressive demoncraps are low grade morons.

    1. They won’t have to round up most of the 360 million firearms in public hands as most law abiding gun owners will freely hand them over hoping to avoid any confrontation with the authorities. And you can bet Hillary and the rest of the gun grabbers are fully aware of that fact.

  9. I never heard of a gun manufacturer telling anybody to kill or harm another human being it is the gangbangers in scumbag human beings that are killing other human beings said that being Hillary Clinton is nothing but a domestic terrorist she has flip-flopped so many issues she will say whatever it takes to win her the presidency which we have to make sure we vote for Bernie Sanders on Tuesday that being said next time Goldman Sachs in the rest of the big banks that have given her campaign donations destroy the economy like they did in 2007 and 2008 we should sue them meaning that terrorist Hillary Clinton for being liable because that’s what she wants to do to the major gun corporations because we all remember when we bailed out the banks their CEOs got major major bonuses while the American people suffered for their doings in that one Bankster or CEO has Has not gone to jail or faced any punishment for what they’ve done to this country Hillary Clinton needs to shut her fat mouth!!!!!!

  10. “One of the ordinary modes by which tyrants accomplish their purposes without resistance is by disarming the people and making it an offense to keep arms.” — Joseph Story (1779-1845)

    “NEVER FORGET, even for an instant, that the ONE AND ONLY REASON anybody has for taking your gun away is to MAKE YOU WEAKER than he is, so he can do something to you that you wouldn’t let him do if you were equipped to prevent it. This goes for burglars, muggers, and rapists, and even more so for policemen, bureaucrats, and politicians.” –- Aaron Zelmanm

  11. Gun Owners UNITE we must not let Lieing Hillary. Be elected this would take us back300 years You know she is Obama’s step child.Everyone must vote against Lieing Hillary .Government. Wants total control.Vote.No on Hillary buy back scheme.And 4 more years of Obama mimics.

  12. It would certainly help our cause if the posters were literate or they re-read their emails BEFORE hitting POST!

    The egregious errors in the last comment above hurt the entire movement by making it seem as if the ‘gun lovers’ are all illiterate red-necks. .

    1. You can say that again, William Keen. The shrill bloviating here and elsewhere really does a massive disservice to those of us who own guns but do not aspire to be fat, illiterate Mormon militia members who believe their re-written Constytooshun gives then the right to foment seditious civil war and cherry pick lies from someone they have sworn to hate while ignoring a fascist, bigoted 0.1%er con man who makes their movement look exactly like Nazi rallies in 1930s Germany. Now, as then, it is a sure bet that it won’t be “libruls” who take our guns; it will be their own choice of authoritarian fascists wrapped in the flag and thumping their Bibles.

    2. I’m thinking your vitriolic screed jumps you up two slots, to be lumped in with Simon’s tripe. But, that’s just my opinion.

  13. I believe that establishments which ban legally carried weapons from their premises have in fact formed a special duty to provide total security for all future patrons. A failure to protect anyone is, most likely, legally a breach of that duty.

  14. It never ceases to amaze me what lies comes out of Hillary Clinton’s mouth. As illustrated in the last two articles, she will stop at nothing to get her agendas past, and take away the second amendment. You have to remember why the second amendment was written in the first place. Before the revolutionary war the British we’re confiscating all the guns and gun powder they could. This is the main reason why the second amendment was written into the constitution. It is to protect the citizens from an overzealous government trying to take away our rights as citizens. This country will never be the same if Hillary Clinton is elected. You think it’s bad now just imagine how it’s going to be with the biggest liar and anti-gun president in the history of this country! There is nothing she will stop at to confiscate our guns and kill the Second Amendment. She will lie cheat and lie about it again just to get what she wants, remember these words.
    The thing that baffles me, is that otherwise very intelligent people, some of them my friends, are very well educated, yet are backing Hillary for president. I just don’t understand how intelligent people could swallow her lies. Not just some of the time, but all the time. You would think that sometime someplace one of these times, one of her lies would not make sense to these people, but they follow her like blind sheep… I don’t understand, but that’s the way I see it ! These are so-called well educated, intelligent people! But they just don’t get it.

    1. As I’ve said many other times, the only time hilLIARy Clinton is NOT lying is when she is inhaling.

  15. Hillary is a disaster. Vote for Bernie, 2016!! Seriously though, I don’t know why people can’t see that she’s a blatant liar. Every day.

  16. Both my wife and I have our CWP but we “Open Carry” most of the time while wearing yellow T-shirts that clearly say “Good Guy (Gal) with a gun here to make sure YOU are protected! Ask me why?

    We always carry a paper listing the lies of those like Hillary, Bloomberg and others and why they wants guns gone. It explains in detail how and why the 2nd Amendment came about and why it is even more relevant today. We show them actual FBI Stats on crimes committed by gun owners. We also carry cards that say “Because you are a “Gun Free” establishment in the future we will be taking our business else ware.
    Most take those cards to management and they call us and say “We’re sorry that’s just our policy”
    Our response usually centers around the fact that they could be sued for a wrongful death suit by preventing a person from defending themselves in their establishment due to such policies. And the fact is ours is an open carry. state so in essence they are violating state law.
    Most respond one of two ways. They either hang up or they want to know more. Those who wanted to know more and did their research usually end up changing their no gun policy. Unless its a Big Box store. Do what you can to support the 2nd Amendment
    Because The Price of Liberty is eternal Vigilance!

  17. And the leading, goose-stepping fascist Teapublican candy date has a lock on honesty. This is sad, really sad.

    1. @ Tominator,

      No, what is sad is your overused and weak attempt to evade this issue with your childish “he did it too” routine. Even sadder is your wasted effort to troll this article, because no matter what you post, this conversation will still be about Hillary’s lies and no one else.

      But since you brought up that they are both liars, allow me to help you distinguish the differences in their choice of lies. Only one of these liars is under federal investigation and facing prison while the other will be heading to the White House… can you guess which one it is?

      I guess there is a big difference in what one chooses to lie about then isn’t there?

    2. Thanks, G-Man. I’ll keep this little snippet and maybe we’ll bring it back and talk again on November 9. I’d like that.

      Oh, and just because a fellow customer of CTD disagrees with your politics doesn’t make them a “troll”. Toodles!

    3. @Tominator:

      Anyone who uses the word “toodles” is a card carrying liberal, and also not someone I’d want to hang out with, and definitely not go camping with 😛

      Hillary is going to be dragged through the mud by Trump, in the media and in person. I’m just going to sit back and get some popcorn and enjoy the show 🙂

    4. @ Trollminator,

      Taking vacation this week so I have extra time on my hands to help a brother out.

      It is comically obvious you have no clue what a troll is, but you are most definitely the epitome of its definition. The majority of your posts and their intent match the precise types of actions that originally led to the terminology we’ve come to know as “trolling”. You can disagree with facts all you want, but then, that is part of what makes you a troll.

      Another interesting characteristic of trolls is that you all are so busy trying to be obnoxious that rather than earnestly make any attempt towards a real contribution, you instead just simply get everything wrong. Like you just did…

      In your constant effort to maintain your trollminance your mind was so busy racing for the next sarcastic punchline that instead of actually comprehending what was actually written to you, you concocted abstract versions of what it is you thought was posted. And since what was actually posted versus what you perceived are two completely different things, not only do your responses have no continuity, but you never actually address your replies with any meaningful substance.

      Case and point: Nowhere did I ever allude to my choice in politics; you made that assumption and thereafter invented your own disagreement – like a troll often does. As I’ve already stated, you so badly need to troll that you concoct something from that which was never said, just to give yourself a perceived reason to fire back a counterproductive trollistic sarcasm.

      So as I’ve already mentioned, the result of your fruitless efforts end up lacking any type of continuity and therefore float out there as misplaced orphans without any meaning or genuine purpose. And that is sadly quite counterproductive by any standard.

      However, there is more bad news for you in that psychiatrists have proven that our Internet personalities are a wide open window into who we are in real life. Exhibiting the need to constantly troll others speaks volumes which exposes your insecurities in the real world that leads to such pathetic online behavior.

      Specifically they (psychiatrists) say trollers are akin to bullies, but not in the common sense. What they say is that trolls are usually themselves victims of bullying but they never had the courage to stand up for themselves and fight back, and so they take out their frustrations on other innocent people in the form of trolling.

      On a side note, there is no need to compare notes in November because that stems from your own invented perception of a political argument that simply never existed outside your own imagination stemming from your trollsadistic tendency.

      My original post was to merely point out your pathetic digression which resorted to calling a tit-for-tat on liars as if it somehow makes what Hillary did okay. My comment was irrespective of politics and focused on the named people and their lies. So thereafter I factually pointed out the detrimental results of her lies, which are irrefutable given Hillary is in-fact under federal investigation and facing federal charges while Trump is in-fact heading for the Whitehouse. I never said he’d make it, and don’t really care either. But the fact is he is clearly “heading” that way.

      So in light of your special needs, I thought I’d contribute by giving you the attention you so badly crave as a troll and give you a new title – and thus I proclaim that from this day forward you shall be known to all as the TROLLMINATOR.

  18. Moe hillary bs lies ,does this woman even know what the word honesty means ? It seems to me any lie will help them pass their anto gun agenda on to unknowing Americans is a pathetic attempt ant mis information and utterly ridiculous as her e mail scandals and fast n furious they lie and lie then lie again to the American public and look to austricize all us gun owners who have never broken law 1 total bs this is just a taste of what a hillary clinton as the POTUS would be like it will be much worse she could win and if we do not spread the word they will elect her .And she will appoint the most anti gun judges to scotus we have ever seen sit on that bench in the black robe .

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